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  <title>Middletown Forum : 2 for 1 Petition??</title>
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   <title>2 for 1 Petition?? :    spiderjohn wrote: Well--they...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1704&amp;PID=9587&amp;title=2-for-1-petition#9587</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=303">lrisner</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 1704<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Aug&nbsp;09&nbsp;2009 at 3:22pm<br /><br /><table width="99%"><tr><td class="BBquote"><img src="forum_images/quote_box.png" title="Originally posted by spiderjohn" alt="Originally posted by spiderjohn" style="vertical-align: text-bottom;" /> <strong>spiderjohn wrote:</strong><br /><br /><br><div>&nbsp;</div><div>Well--they were/are all at-large representatives.</div><div>&nbsp;</div><div>To blame our history of bad decisions and failures on the ward system/ward reps is ludicrous and dangerously decieving.</div></td></tr></table><br><br>That you very much, Steve!<br>]]>
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   <pubDate>Sun, 09 Aug 2009 15:22:35 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>2 for 1 Petition?? : So--do y&amp;#039;all like what is...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1704&amp;PID=9580&amp;title=2-for-1-petition#9580</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=18">spiderjohn</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 1704<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Aug&nbsp;09&nbsp;2009 at 12:32pm<br /><br />So--do y'all like what is making headlines on the county level?<DIV>Do y'all see what happens when it becomes convenient to elect a select group continually to run a municipal operation?</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV><DIV>With separate ward elections, it becomes both unmanageable and expensive to dominate four different elections, especially in areas of the city where the "chosen few" have much less support(control). There ARE competent citizens willing to serve in every area of the city, and regionalism MUST be a factor in local government. We have all experienced what happens to the "have nots" when a close-knit group of "haves" control virtually everything. Once again--reference the Butler County situation, with Hamilton/West Chester being the "haves" and Middletown/everywhere else being the "have nots".</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></DIV><DIV>Pass this ballot issue, and Middletown Council/Admin will be a much more closed shop than even today. One election--one pool to get at least three like-minded neighbors to keep the agenda to ruin in smooth operation and control. If you think that we have trouble NOW getting qualiofied diverse citizens to run/participate, imagine the procedure/cost under an all "at-large" situation.</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>We have more pressing issues than this, and the urgency of this referendum is puzzling.</DIV><DIV>Mr.Michel,Mrs.Mort,Mr.Scorti are not elected officials and hardly should over-rule Council on a confusing ballot language issue such as this.</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>Do you like the results of Mayor Mulligan during his tenure?</DIV><DIV>Mr.Becker's time as city manager and Council rep(when the Section 8 flood occurred on his watch, along with Judge Powers' ill-concieved overthow of then Mayor Schiavone)?</DIV><DIV>Noah Poiwers anti-citizen run as Council/Mayor?</DIV><DIV>Bob Wells tantrum over seating?</DIV><DIV>Ms.Williams' tirades?</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>Well--they were/are all at-large representatives.</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>To blame our history of bad decisions and failures on the ward system/ward reps is ludicrous and dangerously decieving.</DIV>]]>
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   <pubDate>Sun, 09 Aug 2009 12:32:01 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>2 for 1 Petition?? : VV- is there a substantial group...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1704&amp;PID=9577&amp;title=2-for-1-petition#9577</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=308">accuro</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 1704<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Aug&nbsp;09&nbsp;2009 at 12:05pm<br /><br />VV- is there a substantial group of elite or prominent citizens disgusted and knowing full well how Middletown is in a ruined state? You betcha. The problem is no alternatives are running. Dan Picard is as tight with the 'inner circle' as anyone in my opinion. Know him, know his former wife well, know many partners at his old firm at Frost, hand picked in my opinion. A common denominator in most of the problems within Middletown, the alleged "ruling class" has a bond with a "c".&nbsp; What's Michel getting for the bidding...a promise they'll they him a few bones that Berns doesn't want? Just my opinion of course, and rather apparent focus upon that wondergul historic region downtown,. How nice; Mulligan lives there, Kohler, others. Make it the Upper Arlington of Middletown. I'd think some realtors like Jim Sawyer would be asking why the city isn't doing much in other areas. The house on the right entrance on DaVinci has been on the market now &gt; 3 years. Dr. Ionna gave up on his. &nbsp; &nbsp;]]>
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   <pubDate>Sun, 09 Aug 2009 12:05:41 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>2 for 1 Petition?? : accuro- I live on the other side...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1704&amp;PID=9569&amp;title=2-for-1-petition#9569</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=114">VietVet</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 1704<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Aug&nbsp;09&nbsp;2009 at 10:35am<br /><br />accuro- I live on the other side of the Oaks on Rachel but was raised over on Grand by Dorset. I know how I have always felt about the "clubbers" running the town. Have seen it since the 60's with the influential people from Armco, other business people, and the wealthy running the town and to he-- with what us working people had to say. I have a question- Is there a large number of the "silent elite" in town, that are fed up with the way the town is being run, the city leaders and their direction for the town and the apparent agenda of the Middletown Moving Forward people trying to control the town and would like to see and support some candidates that have the ideas (ie- 180 degree ideas) that are currently being offered? <br /><br />Comment for Mr. Michel- Your petition, on the surface is the right thing to do. Council should not have a sayso as to what goes to the voters and what doesn't. ALL recommendations from the Charter Committee should go to the voters. HOWEVER- The content of your petition and the choices it offers, forces the voter to vote on negative items- eliminating the ward system which removes representation for all people in all areas of town while helping the controllers of the town to maintain that control by sponsoring their power broker puppet candidates from primarily two sections of the city- the 1st and 3rd Wards. I live in the third ward and I want to see EVERYONE represented in this town. Do you honestly think that if Council was comprised of all 1st/3rd Ward candidates that they would care at all about the people in the 2nd/4th Wards? Doubtful. By allowing Mort, Scorti and other "legends in their own mind" people to direct your petition activities and by simply believing what they're shoveling, you are actually helping this town fall further into the abyss. If you help these very people who are taking this city in the wrong direction, you are countering your statement that you care about this town. Their track record speaks for itself. Look at the condition of the city. How do you think it got that way? --- It was caused by the same people that you are trusting. Look past their sales pitch. JMO]]>
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   <pubDate>Sun, 09 Aug 2009 10:35:31 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>2 for 1 Petition?? : By the way, it should be pretty...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1704&amp;PID=9565&amp;title=2-for-1-petition#9565</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=308">accuro</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 1704<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Aug&nbsp;09&nbsp;2009 at 9:57am<br /><br />By the way, it should be pretty obvious what this reduction is about.&nbsp; The Highlands Historical group led by Kohler, Ann's dear friend, want many buildings torn down and the historical area protected to get their property values up, at the expense of other neighborhoods. Therefore, they have their landscaper in my opinion doing their bidding to dominate council and make their area the number one priority. The highest priority is to get this on the ballot? How amusing. Lets get a reversal to get all funds taken out for 20 yrs from the infrastructure fund put back to where it should be, lets get some accountability for decisions that affect all residents (and I live in one the nicest areas in the city near Thatcher), not just the "chosen" clubbers, and lets get some adequate transparency in city hall than the Circle of 100 to let the city leadership run over its citizens. Whether you know it all not, not one resident in MIddletown hasn't been ruined by city leadership, and the lack thereof. And the movers and shakers know it- ask them if their young adults just graduating from college are running the 2nd and 3rd generation businesses? They'll laugh and say, "No, they are out of state, and we are planning on moving next year ourselves." &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;]]>
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   <pubDate>Sun, 09 Aug 2009 09:57:02 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>2 for 1 Petition?? : Irisner just what would youcall,...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1704&amp;PID=9563&amp;title=2-for-1-petition#9563</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=358">wasteful</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 1704<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Aug&nbsp;09&nbsp;2009 at 9:55am<br /><br />Irisner just what would you&nbsp;call, ".....the middle of the night to go down to black town......"?]]>
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   <pubDate>Sun, 09 Aug 2009 09:55:38 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>2 for 1 Petition?? : It is obvious to those who are...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1704&amp;PID=9562&amp;title=2-for-1-petition#9562</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=308">accuro</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 1704<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Aug&nbsp;09&nbsp;2009 at 9:45am<br /><br />It is obvious to those who are campaigning for this, there is a motivation to do it, some benefit as sj said, the usual "persons of interest" are involved. Recall when the school joint and system didn't bifurcate issues, that failed, so there is hope. And hopefully, it will help some wards get out and defeat it. Don't think for a minute people serving on council and the school board don't have any agendas ranging from insuring their kids get the best grades, the best scholarships, the best entry into school, the nest charter school- hello Ms. Andrews, the best move of the charter school into their neighborhood- hello Mr. Marconi- Rosedale, they are motivated for thir own interests. <br><br>In reality, why not just dumpt city council and the school board altogether, they generallly are poor leaders and are more in tune with what the school system and the city leadership want, than the mass population in the city desires anyway. Hence, they provide no value so purge the all. But, its clear what this effort is about. I agree with sj, vote no. Don't let the inept bidders for leadership gain more power to ruin the city than they alerady have. The audicity of Andrews out there, "gotta spend money to make monye" is really appaling in my opinion. <br><br>These leaders which I laugh as I write it, have done sufficiebt damge it would take at least a generation to begin to repair Middletown. Heard the saying "I wouldn't touch that with a ten ft pole?" Most outside Middletown wouldn't touch it with a "5 mile pole?" I think its a shame good spokesmen like Mr. Woods and others don't run. Some better be waking up; there are not going to be changes on the city council favorable. Petitions should be flying now instead of waiting for an outcome that won't be pretty, I will make that guarantee. &nbsp;]]>
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   <pubDate>Sun, 09 Aug 2009 09:45:22 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>2 for 1 Petition?? :  Jeff Michel: Why Middletown...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1704&amp;PID=9561&amp;title=2-for-1-petition#9561</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=358">wasteful</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 1704<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Aug&nbsp;09&nbsp;2009 at 9:23am<br /><br /><DIV =cxArticleer><H1 =articleline>Jeff Michel: Why Middletown needs an at-large council</H1><H2 =articleSubline></H2></DIV><DIV id=cxArticleText><SPAN =credit><SPAN =credit></SPAN></SPAN><DIV id=cxArticleText><SPAN =publishdate>3:06 PM Friday, August 7, 2009 </SPAN><P><P>From the time I moved here some 3-1/2 years ago, I’ve always tried to be an active citizen. I go to many City Council meetings and have helped with a few community groups along the way. I felt this was the greatest opportunity to get out and meet new people in Middletown.</P><P>Aware of some of the antics of City Council and the in-fighting at that time, I soon saw this wasn’t the direction of a winning team. I began to speak to neighbors and people throughout the town and noted a theme: A great apathy towards the city of Middletown and its governing members. I decided to get busy and help with as much as I could.</P><P>Soon that interest led to many other groups inviting me to work on committees, ranging from the air show to Sunset Park relandscaping.</P><P>After council had been given advice from its own hand-picked charter review committee and chose not to put all of the recommended issues on the November ballot, I had to take a stand. I felt my right to vote had been stripped away.</P><P>Because council didn’t allow the voters to vote, I was compelled to obtain a petition for the purpose of adding Ordinance 02009-46 to the Nov. 3 ballot. Of the three proposed charter changes not added to the ballot, this change seemed the most important.</P><P>This ordinance would allow the voters of Middletown to decide if they want to reduce the size of City Council from seven to five members and to allow all eligible residents to vote for each of the four at-large seats and the directly elected mayor.</P><P>I feel this is one of the many important steps toward building a better future for Middletown.</P><P>We need to reduce the size of council from seven to five members and have an at-large council for many reasons:</P><P>• The reduction from seven to five council members is the best way to get a more efficient governing body.</P><P>• The short history of the ward system since 1994, when it began, has shown very little positive change in the level of growth. In fact, I would say the city has progressively gotten worse in the last decade. Since council is the governing body, I would have to put part of the blame on them. Though council has changed recently for the better, I still feel there are too many cooks in the kitchen. So, seven isn’t really helping us get to the goal of bettering our community in the shortest time.</P><P>• The wards, in my opinion, are actually splintering the town. Every community has different socioeconomic groups. By having the wards, we tend to pre-judge the people of that ward because of where they live. There are $50,000 homes and $200,000 homes in all parts of town. Each ward includes every socioeconomic group.</P><P>• All issues should be of equal importance to all parts of every corner of this beautiful city. Do the roads only need to be fixed in one part of town? Is there crime only in one part of town?</P><P>• To say a council person will only defend the ward they live in is unbelievable to me. It goes against the “work as one team” goal. We must work together! Bring the issues from each neighborhood and let’s debate them in council chambers. If we only work in our own small area of town, the rest of the town loses out and we all falter again.</P><P>• Good candidates willing to run are few and far between. We need to make the opportunity to serve available, regardless of where they might live.</P><P>• Our council represents 51,000 people. Of all those potential candidates, I get to vote for two sometimes and four when at-large candidates run. I can’t vote on a representative for another area but the decisions made by that council member affect all parts of town.</P><P>• This charter issue, if passed, will take effect in 2014. This long-range planning is vital for the future.</P><P>• This move would also save the city $10,000 per year by eliminating the salaries of two council members.</P><P>All locations in Middletown are important to me. I hope the town is important to all who live here, not just small neighborhoods here and there.</P><P>We owe it to Middletown to have all available opportunities laid out before us. If everyone who is eligible to vote does so, that’s the direction I feel is most fair.</P><P>This ordinance is of such great importance to this town that it has become a divisive factor in the decision of many to reject the opportunity to vote at all. Don’t let people talk you out of one of your most important rights — the right to vote.</P><P>Signing the petition is just to get the issue on the ballot. It does not mean you are for or against the proposed ordinance change; it means you’d like the opportunity to vote on it.</P><P><P =note>Jeffrey Michel, a landscape designer, is president of Keep Middletown Beautiful, president of the Highlands Historic District and a member of the City Tree Commission.</P><P></P><P></P></DIV></DIV>]]>
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   <pubDate>Sun, 09 Aug 2009 09:23:35 +0000</pubDate>
   <guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1704&amp;PID=9561&amp;title=2-for-1-petition#9561</guid>
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   <title>2 for 1 Petition?? : Seems that a well-oiled fine-tuned...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1704&amp;PID=9558&amp;title=2-for-1-petition#9558</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=18">spiderjohn</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 1704<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Aug&nbsp;09&nbsp;2009 at 6:28am<br /><br />Seems that a well-oiled fine-tuned machine(manned by the usual MMF faces) was out in full force yesterday to work the petitions. <DIV>Mr.Scorti, Mrs.Mort, Ms.Andrew of the school board et al to aid Mr.Michel's"spontaneous on his own" referendum.</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>Wondering why other issues like getting our road funds back in order(along with a sewer fund) and separated from the general fund haven't been championed by the same faces with such urgency?</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>Looks as if MMF is in full operation, and this is just one phase of a Council election day agenda.</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>Nothing wrong oin voting, I guess, however the co-ordination and mission is more than curious and actually predicted/expected.</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>Why scapegoat the ward system&nbsp; for 30+ years of bad decisions and mis-appropriated spending, alll fueled by the "movers and shakers" backing this referendum? Of course no bad decisions were made on their part!</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>Don't sign--Vote no!</DIV>]]>
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   <pubDate>Sun, 09 Aug 2009 06:28:43 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>2 for 1 Petition?? :    wasteful wrote:It seems that...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1704&amp;PID=9555&amp;title=2-for-1-petition#9555</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=303">lrisner</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 1704<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Aug&nbsp;08&nbsp;2009 at 11:50pm<br /><br /><table width="99%"><tr><td class="BBquote"><img src="forum_images/quote_box.png" title="Originally posted by wasteful" alt="Originally posted by wasteful" style="vertical-align: text-bottom;" /> <strong>wasteful wrote:</strong><br /><br />It seems that their are numerous city's that operate in Ohio with all AT-Large Council Members.&nbsp; Lebanon being the closest, I believe Cincy does also.&nbsp;&nbsp; So what is the beef.<div>&nbsp;</div><div>And 2000+ I wondered who&nbsp;was going to&nbsp;play the Race card&nbsp; first on this issue.&nbsp; I wouldn't get out of bed in the Middle of the night to go to Ward 1, 2, 3, or 4, unless there was a Natural Disaster.</div></td></tr></table><br><br><br>Race Card? Spare me!<br>]]>
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   <pubDate>Sat, 08 Aug 2009 23:50:20 +0000</pubDate>
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