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  <title>Middletown Forum : State Of The City Address</title>
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  <pubDate>Wed, 07 Oct 2026 00:08:52 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>State Of The City Address : acclaro - I agree wholeheartedly...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3748&amp;PID=26217&amp;title=state-of-the-city-address#26217</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=755">TonyB</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 3748<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Mar&nbsp;30&nbsp;2011 at 3:01pm<br /><br />acclaro - I agree wholeheartedly that there is too close association between office seekers and unions. There is the same, too close association&nbsp; between big business, big Pharma, big banks, etc. and office seekers. These financial burdens are being caused by special interest on both sides who put the interest of those who finance their campaign over the interest of the country. I do believe that public employees realize it can no longer be business as usual. At least I hope they do. I wonder if other special interests will get the message.]]>
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   <pubDate>Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:01:50 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>State Of The City Address : TonyB, I concur with al your points...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3748&amp;PID=26203&amp;title=state-of-the-city-address#26203</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=334">acclaro</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 3748<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Mar&nbsp;30&nbsp;2011 at 10:48am<br /><br />TonyB, I concur with al your points well made.&nbsp;i respectfully agree to disagreewith your last point on the scapegoating of public servants. What has occurred is that segment has been in a position there has evolved a very close association between the office seekers and the unions (public servants). What is presently under attack is the cost of pensions, as we have 50 year olds retiring on 90% of salary, and enjoying it for 25-30 years. The financial burden in these conditions is just unsustainable. Hence, there is no deliberate scapegoating, there is a mandated need to face the economic facts projected over a relatively short period of time. Such projections indicate both state, municipalities, and of course, the country, will be immenient danger of the collapse of the system associated with overwhelming debt. When that occurs, it makes every community, state, and our country unstable and subject to greater harm than what could be caused by terrorism or a massive&nbsp;natural disaster akin to what hit Japan. The scapegoating some may call it, it an evaluation of financial reality on the horizon. <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>Good point on the house ownership TB. I guess for many that would love to get out of middletown, we are doomed to be held hostage, licking our wounds, while putting solar&nbsp;panel and other green means to minimize our expenditures as we can't get out of the quicksand.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</DIV>]]>
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   <pubDate>Wed, 30 Mar 2011 10:48:00 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>State Of The City Address : acclaro - tried twice to respond...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3748&amp;PID=26202&amp;title=state-of-the-city-address#26202</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=755">TonyB</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 3748<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Mar&nbsp;30&nbsp;2011 at 10:28am<br /><br />acclaro - tried twice to respond to your comments and interupted both times. third times the charm! lol<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>IMO there should be a progressive (uh oh, there's that word) income tax. The more you make, the higher percentage you pay based on the argument that the wealthy derive more benefit from a free society. I've discussed the basic unfairness of our current tax structure. At the moment, the wealth of this country is concentrated at the top. In a consumer-based economy, the more people with money, the stronger the economy. I do not propose a re-distribution of wealth; what I propose is more in line with what happened during the last serious economic downturn. Use tax revenues to rebuild our infrastructure to take advantage of new technologies. The "Manhatten Project" this country desperately needs is to get the US off of an oil-based economy. So long as our enemies control the oil, we are in danger.</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>I also am of the opinion we need a constituitional amendment to term limit members of Congress. No elected official should ever serve long enough to get a pension. IMO elected office is not a "job", it is a "service" , they should not receive a "salary" but "compensation" for their time. It's galling to me to watch career politicians say that we're broke when they caused it and they will walk away with their gov. pension and free health care. That needs to come to a screeching halt!</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>I&nbsp;also believe that once the tax code is simplified, we send the accountants from the IRS over to the Dept. of Justice to straighten out this bank fiasco. Someone needs to go to jail over this mess.</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>It is going to take a while for property values to rebound from the mess the banks and mortgage companies have perpetrated. For now, it seems best to stay in the home you have and do everything to make your house more energy efficient. The goal there should be to have your house make money for you instead of your property costing you money. That is where innovation and new technologies need to come into play. </DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>Finally, we need to stop scapegoating the public employee and place the blame squarely where it belongs: our elected leaders. Term limits, campaign and election reforms are needed there. If the electorate "can't see the trees for the forest", we need leaders who will step out of the forest and advocate what is best for the country instead of leaders whose only concern is reelection and the cushy government pension and free health care they'll get if they can just stick around long enough. It needs to start here because if not here, where?</DIV>]]>
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   <pubDate>Wed, 30 Mar 2011 10:28:59 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>State Of The City Address : Viet Vet - it&amp;#039;s an honor...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3748&amp;PID=26196&amp;title=state-of-the-city-address#26196</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=755">TonyB</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 3748<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Mar&nbsp;29&nbsp;2011 at 9:51pm<br /><br />Viet Vet - it's an honor to respond to to your sincere and honest comments, this is how understandings are forged and consensus on actions are reached. <DIV></DIV>I find your comparison of the union-non union work place interesting. Individual workers are always at a disadvantage in an industrial setting; that's why unions had their beginnings in factories. They give a worker some protection from the situations you describe. It is unfortunate that the protection for good workers turned into protecting membership in the union. My father worked for GM for 30 yrs and he did not always see eye to eye with the union. He also did not want to advance up the management ladder because he was reluctant to give up those union guarantees. Being downsized is a common occurance in private sector jobs. That, supposedly, was the advantage to a public sector job; the job security. I agree that those days are numbered given the continuation of present trends.<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>The contention that most public service jobs require more education and have greater demands is a generalization. Corporate America can compare; I do believe there might be more teachers, police officers, firefighters, etc. than top level management in corporate America. The difference there is pay. I don't care how high Ginger Smith, Debbie Alberico or Bill Becker rose in the public sector,&nbsp;a comparable position at P&amp;G would have paid much more. The difference there is that unqualified people in the private sector rarely rise that high unless they are outstanding employees; the same cannot be said for public service employees. Sometimes, all a public employee has to do is stay around to rise to his highest level of inefficiency.</DIV><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>]]>
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   <pubDate>Tue, 29 Mar 2011 21:51:20 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>State Of The City Address : TonyB- some more comments to respond...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3748&amp;PID=26193&amp;title=state-of-the-city-address#26193</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=114">VietVet</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 3748<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Mar&nbsp;29&nbsp;2011 at 9:10pm<br /><br />TonyB- some more comments to respond to....<br /><br /><br /> "My contention is that for most public service jobs, the educational requirements are higher and the demands are greater".- Tony, I would be willing to bet that you have never experienced the pressure and demands of corporate America such as P&G. It is a meat grinder each and every day. So much competition to get the attention of the big shots who are grading how one contributes on their respective projects at the tech centers. <br /><br />"Formal education is not always a necessary requirement for a private sector worker; skill, smarts, determination; these things have turned people without a college degree into millionaires". Maybe in the 50's and 60's hard work, determination, smarts, etc. would get you up the ladder but since the 70's, private industry almost always requires a college degree if you want to have a chance at advancement. In some places, if you start as a non-degreed employee, you stay in the status of a non-degreed employee, even if you go to school at night and get your degree- some companies have this stigma that if you came in non-degreed, you don't enter the company with the status of a degreed person. Companies won't consider you for a higher position without the sheepskin. About the best you will do is a floor supervisor without that degree in industry. <br /><br />"Public service jobs do not offer the possibility of that kind of advancement". I would imagine that there have been some people promoted within the Midd. city building who haven't had the credentials, nor the degree who have been placed in upper level positions. How about the woman who was the Director of Public Works- Ginger Smith. Did she have a degree? How about Debbie Alberico's position as the school spokesperson to the tune of 98 thou a year or so? Does she have a degree or was she brought up because someone liked her and sponsored her to this lofty paying position? I'm sure Gilleland has her pets and has promoted people based on her liking them and not because they were qualified. Happens everywhere. Hell, Bill Becker was given the city manager's job and he didn't have a day in as a city manager anywhere. Same goes for his new job as emergency director (or whatever he's called) in Warren County. No experience there either. Just given the job because he interfaced with it as the police chief. Just seems like there are plenty of opportunities for advancement in the public realm. People constantly coming and going. Look at Robinette.  ]]>
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   <pubDate>Tue, 29 Mar 2011 21:10:32 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>State Of The City Address : TonyB- I need to comment on some...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3748&amp;PID=26192&amp;title=state-of-the-city-address#26192</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=114">VietVet</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 3748<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Mar&nbsp;29&nbsp;2011 at 8:37pm<br /><br />TonyB- I need to comment on some of your thoughts on workers in unions versus non-union environments...<br /><br />"The right to strip workers of any say in their working conditions? The right to ASK for a decent wage? It's take what we give you and be happy but, by the way, you'd better perform or we'll take some more from you"<br />Private industry doesn't take any money away from you, they just terminate you if you fail to perform)<br /><br />I have worked non-union shops all my life. Eight to be exact. I have never had a sayso in my working environment. When you accepted the job, you accepted the working environment.Usually weren't that bad to be honest other than overly political. Never had a sayso in the wage either. Again, when you accepted the job, you were told the pay range of the job and you could always opt out in accepting it. And your comment "take what we give you and be happy, but, by the way, you'd better perform or we'll take some more from you"- said a little differently, we'll find someone who will do the job if you don't perform and you can leave the company. Saw this alot in private industry. They would transfer the person or start the documentation to terminate with a verbal warning, then written and finally, out the door in private industry, unless you signed a contract, (which most are not offered), the company can get rid of you anytime they wish. Likewise, you can leave anytime you wish. The union environment protects the worker a little better than this, even the poor workers within their ranks. You're on your own in the private sector. How many times have you or your public sector friends been downsized? I lost my P&G job in 1994. My General Cable job in 1999 and my Thermo Black Clawson job in 2002. How many times has a public sector person lost their job since 1994? Until now, the public sector was the place to go to accrue longevity on the job. Job security went out the window for the private sector twenty plus years ago. The public sector has been lucky.....until now. ]]>
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   <pubDate>Tue, 29 Mar 2011 20:37:32 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>State Of The City Address : Regarding the AK contaminants,...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3748&amp;PID=26191&amp;title=state-of-the-city-address#26191</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=483">Bill</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 3748<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Mar&nbsp;29&nbsp;2011 at 8:13pm<br /><br /><P>Regarding the AK contaminants, is it airborn?&nbsp; is it Dick's Creek?&nbsp; Where is a fearless councilperson to question the water treatment plant and their data?&nbsp; AJ, you have nothing better to do ...get on it...</P>]]>
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   <pubDate>Tue, 29 Mar 2011 20:13:50 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>State Of The City Address : I agree on the house impact bill....</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3748&amp;PID=26190&amp;title=state-of-the-city-address#26190</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=334">acclaro</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 3748<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Mar&nbsp;29&nbsp;2011 at 7:31pm<br /><br />I agree on the house impact bill. that will sure&nbsp;impact Middletown's desireability which is nill anyway. this is Three Mile Island, an Erin Brokavich type deal, contaminated water causing brain cancer. All the specific details and correlation the Ohio Department of Health said was they could not conclusively show correlation. That was because 11 cases of death in a short period. What will it be in 5 more years/ or 10? Frightening to be candid.]]>
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   <pubDate>Tue, 29 Mar 2011 19:31:41 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>State Of The City Address : Andwe thought it was hard to sell...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3748&amp;PID=26189&amp;title=state-of-the-city-address#26189</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=483">Bill</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 3748<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Mar&nbsp;29&nbsp;2011 at 6:26pm<br /><br />And&nbsp;we thought it was hard to sell a house&nbsp;BEFORE this news.<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><DIV>I'd be interested in knowing how many of the 11 (at least) with brain cancer that worked at a particular area of the steel mill. I remember hearing that at least 2-3 of them worked in one small department at AK.</DIV>]]>
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   <pubDate>Tue, 29 Mar 2011 18:26:53 +0000</pubDate>
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   <title>State Of The City Address : As I was reading the article on...</title>
   <link>http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3748&amp;PID=26188&amp;title=state-of-the-city-address#26188</link>
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    <![CDATA[<strong>Author:</strong> <a href="http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/member_profile.asp?PF=334">acclaro</a><br /><strong>Subject:</strong> 3748<br /><strong>Posted:</strong> Mar&nbsp;29&nbsp;2011 at 5:52pm<br /><br />As I was reading the article on the MJ about Middletown being one of a handful of cancer clusters in the US, I was wondering what new impact this revelation will have on the wonderful city? Is our water supply contaminated and provided by Middletown knowing it was mixed with potential toxins from Dick's Creek? Is this rate of incidence much higher than other areas...I think so, or it would not be named a cancer site. This is really&nbsp;an alarming article that begs much deeper and thorough investigation. Take note how quickly the MJ made a wowful attempt to retract the&nbsp;report, after it was already referenced by the Senate floor. This pronouncement is far more damaging to Middletown than a Laura Willaims outburst or a woman dressed as a cow running down the street. Dead city by Forbes, now a cancer cluster revelation. Not positive news.&nbsp;]]>
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   <pubDate>Tue, 29 Mar 2011 17:52:07 +0000</pubDate>
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