Middletown Forum : Goodbye to the Superintendent http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/ This is an XML content feed of; Middletown Forum : Other School Issues : Goodbye to the Superintendent Mon, 05 Oct 2026 15:15:07 +0000 Wed, 03 Jul 2013 14:02:46 +0000 http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Web Wiz Forums 10.12 360 www.middletownusa.com/forum/RSS_post_feed.asp?TID=5338 Middletown Forum http://middletownusa.com/images/blog-logo.jpg http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/ Goodbye to the Superintendent : Too bad that some people ruin... http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38455&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38455 Author: Bocephus
Subject: 5338
Posted: Jul 03 2013 at 2:02pm

Too bad that some people ruin the image for the people that need the help, too many abuse it and the other freebies instead of getting jobs, those are the people that give section 8 a bad name.

]]> Wed, 03 Jul 2013 14:02:46 +0000 http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38455&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38455 Goodbye to the Superintendent : Because of complete lack of leadership... http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38452&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38452 Author: over the hill
Subject: 5338
Posted: Jul 02 2013 at 2:14pm

Because of complete lack of leadership I think they took the "easy" way out. It looked like a way of getting Gov money to use, but greed got in the way.They could not see there will be consequences and now we are paying for their shortsightedness and we still have the same shortsighted "leadership".IMO]]> Tue, 02 Jul 2013 14:14:48 +0000 http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38452&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38452 Goodbye to the Superintendent : sj, agreed....as Vet knws, there... http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38451&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38451 Author: acclaro
Subject: 5338
Posted: Jul 02 2013 at 12:05pm

sj, agreed....as Vet knws, there isn't much such 8 vouchers in Paradise Valley Az.

Hard to fill up Brown's Run, Wildwood, and Weatherwax with those that ride bikes to the course instead of driving a Lexus.

My point was---is it vouchers that drove individuals to Middletown, or lack of industry attractiveness and lack of job creation the creator of poverty leading to appropriate vouchers based upon income? I say the latter, not the 8 magnet.

But....have vouchers, they will come. Or was it build it, they will come. Well Middletown did not build it, they handed out vouchers many think, ergo, chicken and egg theory. HUD should figure that one out, maybe its the egg.
]]> Tue, 02 Jul 2013 12:05:04 +0000 http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38451&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38451 Goodbye to the Superintendent : why can we not "clean-up"... http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38450&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38450 Author: over the hill
Subject: 5338
Posted: Jul 02 2013 at 11:46am

why can we not "clean-up" the Sec 8 program? By this I mean consequences.Maybe removal from the program. It wouldn't take long for the word to spread in the Sec 8 community to clean up your act or be gone. Education can go a long way. You want to spend Gov. money,spend some of that Sec 8 money on education. Many of these people on Sec 8 have lived this way for a long time.Educate them, there is a better way. Just because you're poor does not mean you have to live like pigs. SOAP AND WATER don't cost that much. Sorry about the soapbox]]> Tue, 02 Jul 2013 11:46:37 +0000 http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38450&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38450 Goodbye to the Superintendent : Section 8 is only a problem because... http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38448&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38448 Author: spiderjohn
Subject: 5338
Posted: Jul 02 2013 at 10:04am

Section 8 is only a problem because it is out of proportion and control here.
It must be down-sized IMO.
Not scapegoating all recipients at all.
Section 8 should not be a never-ending way of life.

As for Acclaro's unfortunate high-roller friend-- lived on the edge and crapped out.
Nothing to do with Section 8

Obviously we need life-supporting jobs and amenities to grow our community.]]> Tue, 02 Jul 2013 10:04:08 +0000 http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38448&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38448 Goodbye to the Superintendent : a story relayed:he visited a property... http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38447&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38447 Author: VietVet
Subject: 5338
Posted: Jul 02 2013 at 9:59am

a story relayed:
he visited a property rented to a section 8, asked why he lived in his own filth without ever cleaning....
renter replied "you don't get it---every year, I can move somewhere else cleaned to standard--free of charge--why should I clean anything?"
end of participation in the program
much happier landlord

AND THERE YOU HAVE IT IN A NUTSHELL.......THE CASE AGAINST TOO MUCH SECTION 8 AND THE ATTITUDE OF SOME PARTICIPANTS. IS THIS WHAT WE REALLY WANT TO DEAL WITH IN THIS CITY AT THIS TIME? ]]> Tue, 02 Jul 2013 09:59:30 +0000 http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38447&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38447 Goodbye to the Superintendent : First of all acclaro, personally,... http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38446&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38446 Author: VietVet
Subject: 5338
Posted: Jul 02 2013 at 9:51am

First of all acclaro, personally, I'm glad you are participating again. I find your opinions and info. valuable.

Some comments related to your comments if I may.

"With all due respect, I have to take a stand for this bashing of those unfortunate enough to be on Section 8. I have a friend in Scottsdale Arizona who was a high roller, made over $500,000. annually as an executive. After 2008, he lost his job, was 60, and simply could not find employment. While not on Section 8, he lost a $750,000 home in Scottsdale (Maricopa Cty as VV knows), moved into an apartment, and struggles to stay afloat. I could list many of these same scenarios"

HAVE BEEN THERE THREE TIMES SINCE 1994 IN JOB LOSSES. RECOVERED EACH TIME. SO WILL HE. I EMPATHIZE WITH THE SITUATION EVEN THOUGH THIS GUY WAS WAY OUT OF MY LEAGUE.

"I also know indirectly, and have met, some of absolute most honest, decent, and frankly, hard working people that work at the Salvation Army, Goodwill, elsewhere, and are on Section 8, and take incredible care of their apartment, going as far as painting, mowing grass, and keeping the property up, including doing plumbing work, laying wood floors, et al. This Section 8 bashing and stereotyping is in my opinion, arrogant, wrong, and completely misleading associated with the inherent problems within Middletown"

NEGATIVE PERCEPTION, POOR IMAGE AND STIGMA ATTACHED TO SECTION 8. NO DOUBT THERE ARE SOME HARD WORKING, UPSTANDING CITIZENS WHO TEMPORARLY NEED A HAND UP. THOSE THAT STAY FOREVER STICKING IT TO THE TAXPAYER AND THOSE WHO DESTROY ALL THEY TOUCH CONTINUE THE STEREOTYPING OF THIS PROGRAM. SECTION 8 IN MIDDLETOWN COULD HAVE UPSTANDING PEOPLE TO THE TUNE OF 100%, BUT THE GENERAL CONSENSUS OF THE MASSES IS THAT IT IS A NEGATIVE ENTITY IN ANY COMMUNITY AND A DETRIMENT TO PROGRESSION OF A CITY. LOOK AT THE ROW APARTMENTS AS YOU GO UP THE HILL BY THE EASTRIDGE APARTMENTS. CURTAINS HANGING OUT WINDOWS. TRASH STACKED IN PILES AT ANY GIVEN TIME BY THE ROAD, BLINDS TORN TO PIECES, AND A GENERAL LOOK OF A GHETTO BEING BORN. NO PRIDE, NO CLASS, NO CARING WHAT PEOPLE THINK. THAT ATTRACTS MY ATTENTION IN A NEGATIVE WAY. PROBABLY DOES WITH MANY PEOPLE.

"As Bill or another stated previously, the debate rages as to which came first; the chicken or egg, or in simple terms, Section 8 demographics or the city's failure to attract business, to attract a growing economy, which manifested itself into once middle class individuals having no employment opportunities, which in turn, has led to the circuitous route of decline. I argue it is the city's failure to grow and attract, not the magnet effect of Section 8"

AS I UNDERSTAND IT, THE CITY HAS LOST SO MUCH BUSINESS AND THE TAXES AND REVENUE CREATED BY THOSE BUSINESSES AND HAS BALKED FOR SO MANY YEARS IN REPLACING THOSE LOST BUSINESSES, THAT THEY HAD TO COME UP WITH SOME REVENUE SOME PLACE (SINCE THEY HAVE NO ONE WHO KNOWS HOW TO ATTRACT NEW BUSINESS)......THAT BEING THE FED GOV. HANDOUTS PRIMARILY THROUGH SECTION 8. THIS IN TURN HAS HELPED TO FOSTER MORE CRIME, HAS DONE IMMENSE HARM TO THE REPUTATION OF THE CITY, HAS FOSTERED SOME GHETTO MENTALITY AND HAS HELPED RUN THE CITY INTO THE GROUND IMO.GIVEN THE CONDITION OF THE CITY, THE LAST THING WE NEED IS TO INVITE MORE PEOPLE WHO LIVE OFF OF GOVERNMENT ASSISTANCE PROGRAMS HERE. WE NEED EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE....IE, THOSE WHO MAKE DECENT MONEY WITH DESCRETIONARY SPENDING WHO WILL CREATE MONEY FLOW IN THE COMMUNITY. NOT THE TIME TO CREATE A WINDOW OF OPPORTUNITY FOR THE ASSISTANCE SEEKERS TO CAMP OUT HERE. THIS TOWN IS "TOO POOR TO SUPPORT THE POOR". AFTER ALL, DIDN'T ADKINS CLAIM WE ARE AT THE 54% MARK OF POVERTY HERE?

"I find it wrong to blame Middletown's school problems on Section 8. The factual reality is Middletown is a blue collar town, historically, that previously had a decent middle class base. Times have unfortunately changed, and the days of making $130,000 a year with overtime at Arrnco, now AK Steel of course, are gone. The only entity not effected by that are police, fire, and the school system; private industries made the adjustment years ago"

SECTION 8 SURE AS HELL DIDN'T HELP THE CITY AS TO GROWTH AND PROSPERITY. WOULD A MASON, A SPRINGBORO OR ANY OTHER CITY AROUND HERE COME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT THEY NEEDED THIS LEVEL OF SECTION 8? EVEN FRANKLIN, MONROE AND TRENTON HAD ENOUGH SENSE NOT TO INVITE THIS SATURATION OF POVERTY TO THEIR TOWNS. COMPETENT THINKING MUST PREVAIL AT SOME GIVEN TIME WHEN MAKING DECISIONS IN RUNNING A CITY. WHY DID THE MIDDLETOWN LEADERS COME UP WITH SUCH ASSININE THINKING? DIDN'T SEE ANY OTHER CITY JUMP ON THE FED HANDOUT BANDWAGON.

]]> Tue, 02 Jul 2013 09:51:35 +0000 http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38446&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38446 Goodbye to the Superintendent : With all due respect, I have to... http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38445&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38445 Author: acclaro
Subject: 5338
Posted: Jul 02 2013 at 8:47am

With all due respect, I have to take a stand for this bashing of those unfortunate enough to be on Section 8. I have a friend in Scottsdale Arizona who was a high roller, made over $500,000. annually as an executive. After 2008, he lost his job, was 60, and simply could not find employment. While not on Section 8, he lost a $750,000 home in Scottsdale (Maricopa Cty as VV knows), moved into an apartment, and struggles to stay afloat. I could list many of these same scenarios.

I also know indirectly, and have met, some of absolute most honest, decent, and frankly, hard working people that work at the Salvation Army, Goodwill, elsewhere, and are on Section 8, and take incredible care of their apartment, going as far as  painting, mowing grass, and keeping the property up, including doing plumbing work, laying wood floors, et al. This Section 8 bashing and stereotyping is in my opinion, arrogant, wrong, and completely misleading associated with the inherent problems within Middletown. It is not Section 8, it is the city's failure to be proactive and attract business. Of course, there are a few bad apples. There a few bad rich apples as well in Middletown, and I can name a bushel full.

As Bill or another stated previously, the debate rages as to which came first; the chicken or egg, or in simple terms, Section 8 demographics or the city's failure to attract business, to attract a growing economy, which manifested itself into once middle class individuals having no employment opportunities, which in turn, has led to the circuitous route of decline. I argue it is the city's failure to grow and attract, not the magnet effect of Section 8.

I personally find it difficult to make a plausible case a city that has a majority within the poverty line residing in Middletown, to be in a position it needs to cut back on vouchers. Isn't that a factual reality; that is; Middletown is populated by those that are entitled to Section 8? I blame this strictly on the city leadership, not the souls having the misfortune of being in a position it cost more for gas driving from Middletown to West Chester for a $9.00 hour job.

I find it wrong to blame Middletown's school problems on Section 8. The factual reality is Middletown is a blue collar town, historically, that previously had a decent middle class base. Times have unfortunately changed, and the days of making $130,000 a year with overtime at Arrnco, now AK Steel of course, are gone. The only entity not effected by that are police, fire, and the school system; private industries made the adjustment years ago.

On a sidenote...better be keeping an eye on AK. Stock trading around $3.00/ share is not good, and close to the magical $1.00 range setting up movement off NYSE/ NASDAQ etc. Rumors company wanting that to happen to restructure pension debt, bring in X. If and when that happens, Section 8 will be least of city and citizens worries.     ]]> Tue, 02 Jul 2013 08:47:30 +0000 http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38445&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38445 Goodbye to the Superintendent : have to start somewhere, vethopefully... http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38444&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38444 Author: spiderjohn
Subject: 5338
Posted: Jul 02 2013 at 7:31am

have to start somewhere, vet
hopefully turning a very challenging corner
 
a lot depends on how the section 8 situation plays out
 
dined last night with a landlord with 30 properties
says that he quit Section 8 a couple of years ago--best decision he has made
nowhere near the property destruction or turnover
 
a story relayed:
he visited a property rented to a section 8, asked why he lived in his own filth without ever cleaning....
renter replied "you don't get it---every year, I can move somewhere else cleaned to standard--free of charge--why should I clean anything?"
end of participation in the program
much happier landlord
]]> Tue, 02 Jul 2013 07:31:07 +0000 http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38444&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38444 Goodbye to the Superintendent : Spider:"better attitude--more... http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38443&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38443 Author: VietVet
Subject: 5338
Posted: Jul 02 2013 at 6:17am

Spider:

"better attitude--more inclusive and open"

PROBABLY TRUE, BUT THEN AGAIN, ANY APPROACH IS BETTER THAN THE DAYS OF STEVE PRICE, RIGHT?

Spider:

"slightly better results while worsening demographics"

DEMOGRAPHICS ARE DEFINITELY WORSE. DON'T KNOW ABOUT THE RESULTS. DON'T THINK THE RESULTS ARE MUCH BETTER THAN A DECADE OR TWO AGO ARE THEY? LOOK AT THE INDICATORS. HAVEN'T BROKEN THE 10 BARRIER OUT OF 24 (26?) AS YET, RIGHT? ACTUALLY, AT LAST COUNT, THEY HAD SLIPPED BACK TO 6 FROM 10. NOT GOOD. ARE WE STILL SUFFERING FROM THE PRICE DEBACLE?

Spider:

"the town is not getting better--the schools are imo"

AGREE CONCERNING THE TOWN. NOT SO SURE ABOUT THE SCHOOLS. GOT A LONG WAY TO GO BEFORE THEY BEGIN TO REACH THE LEVELS OF ACCEPTABLE PERFORMANCE. THE SCHOOLS ARE A SHADOW OF WHAT THEY USE TO BE IN OUR DAY, RIGHT SPIDER? AND WITH THE CITY OFFICIALS CONTINUALLY BRINGING LOW INCOME TO TOWN, THE SCHOOLS WILL NEVER BEGIN TO RECOVER. NEED QUALITY PEOPLE WHO PLACE A PRIORITY ON EDUCATION TO IMPROVE THE PERFORMANCE. NOT GOING TO HAPPEN WITH THE CURRENT CROP OF PEOPLE ENTERING THE CITY AND THEIR INDIFFERENCE TOWARD THEIR KID'S EDUCATION.
]]> Tue, 02 Jul 2013 06:17:34 +0000 http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5338&PID=38443&title=goodbye-to-the-superintendent#38443