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Health Board Tax levy

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acclaro View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acclaro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 14 2011 at 11:04am
TonyB- no disrepsect intended, but to keep the topic on topic let me summarize:
 
1) The issue and debate was should a levy be approved, my position which I believe the majority will agree, NO, a levy is not needed, and Butler Cty Health could pick up where there may be a perceived void in Middletown's offerings w/o a levy.
 
2) Butler Cty Health DOES NOT report to the commissioners and has a distant relationship with Butler Cty general operations
 
3) The Board has about 12 members, each within the health field or coming from a strong business leadership environment, with perhaps a wife who may be in the medical profession. There are times multiple candidates apply for positions (unpaid) and are selected upon their medical background and contribution weighed against the total composition of the Board. They DO NOT run for election, but submit their cv and background qualifications.
 
4) I'd take a Board of medical professionals overseeing the operations of medical professions over a city council or school board who are generalists and many times don't have the foogiest notion of the subject matter they are voting on---and become yes men and yes woman. AKA, Middletown city council on many subjects discussed. Do they have an m/a expert sitting? No. A civil engenner? No. A mediator and negotiator? No. A business development executive coming from private sector? No. A black belt certified in operational and talent restructuring? No. Compare that to a medical Board overseeing medical personel.  
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TonyB View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TonyB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 14 2011 at 11:47am
acclaro - none taken. I was curious as to how the Board was comprised. With something as serious as public health, I would hope and pray that they would have knowledgable and qualified individuals willing to serve the community. The very fact that they do this for no compensation makes it a true public service.
 
The health levy notwithstanding, does the city health department do an effective and efficient job? If they can justify to me that they need more resources to combat a potential health problem, I'll support it. Of course, there would have to be some mechanism to guarantee the funds were spent only by the health department for what they said they would be spent for. The "three card monte" that seems to go on with moving funds to and from different accounts makes that kind of guarantee the only way I'd support any tax increase. The same with an infrastructure fund. The same with a public safety levy. If they want to spell it out in the ballot language what the money is for and how it will be spent and if that does not happen the funds should be rebated to taxpayers.
Your number 4 point makes me wonder about other boards at the city and county level. You point out quite correctly that elected representatives may not be knowledgeable about what they vote on and I wonder about other aspects of the city and county. Your point is well taken that about experts on other boards. I thought that for development we had MMF. I don't know about the qualifications or board make-up at the city or county level for other boards.
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Government Big Broth View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Government Big Broth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 14 2011 at 12:44pm
GOD bless Middletown!!I
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spiderjohn View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote spiderjohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 14 2011 at 2:24pm

Fair enough Mr.Self.

Not interested in your inter-departmental gossip or eavesdropping. If you have specific comments made by specific individuals that you would like to relay about about other specific individuals--then spit it out. Quit beating around the bush with innuendos. Plenty of dirt on all of us. Small town--small talk. I seriously doubt that most within Admin like any of us, and many would love to see us go up in flames. No shocker there.
 
This topic is based on the future of the Middletown Dept. of Health and it's possible joining with Public Safety for a .5% tax levy.
 
It has absolutely nothing to do with you or me. Sorry to refer to your post as garbage. Not a constructive tone--should have kept my thinking to myself.
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acclaro View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acclaro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 14 2011 at 3:47pm
Good lord, you are joking aren't you spider? The city thinks they can do nothing in services, take the previous funds for safety and the best paid workers in Middletown are the city workers, sperad that out among other departments, take away leaf pickup, destroy our streets and property value, and the fools in Middletown WILL STILL vote yes for a levy? I know the area is called Middletucky, and for a reason, but is there intelligence to be found in the city? 2.0%, what a joky. 
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acclaro View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acclaro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 14 2011 at 5:11pm
I get it now spiderjohn. With the 2.0% request the ballot language will read:
 
"Do you favor raising rates associated with city tax collection which will also increase services for public health to 2.0% or keep the levy the same at 1.75%?" Oh, something is missing....the .25% roll back. Anyone wanting to organize to defeat this?
 
Time to quit letting a few roll over others when the city is doing nothing to earn 1.75%. Roll Tide (back to 1.5%). What do you think Bill, with the nice creation of the Bloated trademark for Middletown, how's this for a camapign defeat mantra----"Roll Tide" , Back to 1.5%. We'll call it the Walmart strategy, in those roll back price campaigns.Lamp
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Bill View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bill Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 14 2011 at 6:12pm

I can see the flyers now:

"Say no to a Bloated City Future, let's Roll Tide with our taxes back to 1.5%!  ™"
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acclaro View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acclaro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 14 2011 at 6:34pm
Wow! Fantastic and creative Bill. I'll put up a $$$ to have these on every car in town! Love it.    
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike_Presta Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 14 2011 at 10:16pm
Acclaro:
Well, I’d like to help, but as a right wing, upper-class, arrogant, self-seeking, greedy, Wall Street-minded Republican I’m very busy robbing the middle class people of their pensions and mortgages. Evil%20Smile  Between that and taking food from orphans, stealing wheelchairs from the handicapped, and throwing old folks out of nursing homes, I just don’t know how I’d find the time!!!  LOL LOL LOL
“Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012
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acclaro View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acclaro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 14 2011 at 10:51pm
Mike, you can place me in the same category (LOL). But I will still do everything possible and do hope there is an interest in organizing fully to defeat the levy and roll back tax to 1.5%. Between PAC. C State, the school mess, property value ruination, traffic cameras, sewers that are anyone's problem but the city's, extreme incomes for kids that Dad or Mom worked for city hall making in the mid to upper $70's, and the willingness to fix streets by fronting the cash flow, without using tax money, and alloting about $600,000, or less than 1% of the city's operating budget for repair, this city needs to have a wake up call, its over.
And adding insult to injury, we now have the health department needing cash to educate us on swers that the city hasn't repaired in decades, and exposing all the students at Cincinnati State to disease borne by mosquito infected water! That's undoubtedly why they wanted to await the spender of the Manchester, until late fall and winter, when the mosquitos aren't so bad down by the Canal.  
 
I also understand Mike you are starving the elderly, and won't allow illegal immigrants to obtain auto license just to get to and from work. And, because of your unwillingness to regulate Wall Street, we have Dick Creek and cancer clusters. Just think if you were a Democrat, we'd all be driving 70 MPG Prius's costing us $50,000. and applauding Obama pumping up gas to $7.00/gal for taxes, failures in going unto Lybia, that quick weekend victory Hilary predicted, and the devaluation of the dollar againt a barrel of crude. But, then as a Republican, you don't care about clean air, and its perfectly acceptable that Obama wiped out all gains in the renewal of Bush's tax cuts as inflation soars through the roof to keep our earth green and Robert Redford happy. Shameful to be a Republican! Approve  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike_Presta Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 14 2011 at 11:05pm
In all seriousness, City Hall has proven that they can't be trusted with stewardship over any "dedicated" tax.  Count this "Tea Party Republican" IN on any "roll back the tax" effort!!!
“Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012
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acclaro View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acclaro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 14 2011 at 11:24pm
Well then, using the incredibly words of Todd Beamer, who helped bring down the doomed United jet headed for the White House into a crater in western Pennsylvania, what courage and patriotic sacrifice, "Lets Roll." And I do mean it. Non verba gratis. Action, not words this time around.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VietVet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 15 2011 at 6:32am
Shameful to be a Republican.......heck, shameful to be any politican on either side.....and......at any level. The entire Washington scene, Columbus scene and Middletown city scene, from a political/voter/citizen standpoint, is disgusting to see, hear and read about. Is there no one in our corner on anything that is important to the people? No one listening to what we want from our governments? Empty promise liars until elected. Ignoring the people after being elected......all of them. Wish we could clean house at all levels. Problem is, the replacements are clones of the trash we took out. No getting away from the   's we elect and try to replace. All products from the same assembly line.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VietVet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 15 2011 at 6:53am
Originally posted by acclaro acclaro wrote:

Well then, using the incredibly words of Todd Beamer, who helped bring down the doomed United jet headed for the White House into a crater in western Pennsylvania, what courage and patriotic sacrifice, "Lets Roll." And I do mean it. Non verba gratis. Action, not words this time around.


Alright then.....what are we gonna do about it this time? Get a flyer constructed and printed to distribute to the people reminding them about the last safety levy, what it did (or didn't do) for us and how it was used? Take important topics discussed here and remind people what they are getting for their money in this city? Tell them about the advantages of consolidation with Butler County on the Health Levy issue? Explain why the city income tax needs to be rolled back to 1.5% from 1.75%? (can't imagine this being a hard sell)

Develop a phone number to call for info?

List of registered voters in Midd. from Hamilton?

Is there a need to get more people registered to offset the city supporter votes? How do we motivate them to register and show up? Need their help, don't we?

Mass mailing of the info packet discribed above to registered voter households? Cost?

Meeting on who is doing what, where, when? Time ....place?

Cost discussion for info packet/flyer mailing?

Any distribution issues? Places to leave the info. for the most exposure on getting the info. to the people?

Anyone want to take some copies to city hall and distribute?



How about some MMF businesses like Cohen Brothers?

Billboard costs?

Who wants to get a list of people and addresses and personally mail a copy to our friends on council (of send the flyer in as an attachment in an E-mail) and at the city building and those city supporters and big doggies living on Main St. and in the Highlands area?


How serious are we here?




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spiderjohn View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote spiderjohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 15 2011 at 8:57am
Wouldn't it be much quicker, cheaper and easier to find four electable new Council candidates for November?
Without that, little else will be effective.
 
FAST CHEAP and EASY
 
jmo
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acclaro View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acclaro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 15 2011 at 9:14am
Vet, I am dead serious and am willing to meet within a few days notice, to put together a plan of attack, begin fynd raising, to go door to door. I know how the system works in Middletown. First, they exploit the friends of friends, the catholic block (I am one so I know), they leverage the county Republicn party (I know I am one and was offered the number 3 position there which I wasn't interested in the pecking order), then the schools (MUM), then select neighborhoods and the nursing and assisted living homes. We need the lower demographics amd the areas above, getting out people who will vote, but need assistance to vote but the numbers are on the side of the people.
 
spiderjohn, four candidates? Impossible. Josh Laubach was a pleasant surprise to me, in my ward, and I DID vote for him. He is a diamond in the rough. Does he have some candidates that reflect his philosophy and style- I don't know. You---yiu would have tremendous support at large. I am out of town each week more than in town, I could not ever make a commitment, and on my days in state, travel to Columbus or Cincinnati.. We certainly do not need another AJ Smith.
 
Who do you have in mind? In at least two cycles, the only one whom stepped up among many I supported, including Mr. Nagy, who won, was Josh Laubach. MMF will have well known local residents, plucking an Allen out like they did before. And, I don't need a coucil member to pull my NO vote, I do that. That is priority 1, priority 2 takes care of itself, as even existing council would have no choice then but make the tough decisions. Their goal is to keep all downtown happy, our goal should be to take back the town they destroyed.
 
Agreed or disagreed? ;
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote spiderjohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 15 2011 at 10:45am
mostly agree---though without Council support, "we" would have NO Admin support or clout.
In the end, the voters(by choosing a new Council majority focused on a different direction) can change the municipal landscape. I honestly don't see any other realistic way to turn it around in a reasonable time frame. A new Council can quickly change pretty much anything on your laundry list without expense or referendums.
 
We need representatives in the same vein as Ms.Andrews--willing to have dialogue with the MUSAs and similar un-organized but caring pockets of the community(taxpayers). Currently we have a Council that privately follows this site and related thinking, but publicly denigrates and be-littles the different direction and cost-containments.
 
For years(on my own--not really a team player) I have been trying to persuade to run for office those that I think could make a broad and progressive difference. Haven't had much luck. Mr.Smith and Mr.Laubaugh are learning, but have a LONG way to go before they really get it, since they have no real business or financial experience. Mr.Allen and Mayor Mulligan are both cool people, though not pokiticians in the direction we need to make this community whole in direction. Would hope that Ms.Scott-Jones can return--Mr.Becker is probably gone--am OK with Mr.Picard.
 
I have attended enough library meetings with 5-10 MUSA regulars. Not going anywhere. If you plan on following through with the mentioned intentions, you might need to find a very approachable and broadly respected front man to go along with at least 3 electable candidates(one good one to oppose Mr.Allen--I am working on that). Most here(including myself) have burned too many bridges along the way imo.
 
So--clarify--what exactly IS the approach being put together above?
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acclaro View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acclaro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 15 2011 at 11:25am
sj, my personal interest and abilities lie in defeating the levy, and my approach would be to put the strategy and infrastructre to do exactly that---winning at the ballot box. Besides the obvious well knowns we both know, that would be too busy or just not intereested in running, the competent "outsiders" are travelers---tied up in court cases, clients, business, etc. No time to meet twice a month for meetings. Hence, my focus and interest is not as focused as stacking the deck as it is, straggling and starving the beast.
 
Ms. Andrew mentioned cause and affect- ergo Section 8. Perhaps she would have a vested interest, her husband, others that could be recruited. My take is almost all those whom are practicing in Middletown get swooned and overcome by the "love" downtown that they change their position quickly, adopting the "I workd for the city attitude."
 
To summarize, I could name 100 top folks with the talent to make impact, but would not have time. What don't you run, you'd have support, Ms. Andrew or friend of her philosophical beliefs, clones of J Laubach. Candidly, many I know are plotting to get out of twn right now, and running would be no interest.
 
Two choices, organize, and defeat levy, or sit on sideline, and watch a 2.0 levy pass, and Middletown continue to crumble. I'd rather see the beast be taken down, and be put on a diet.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hermes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 15 2011 at 12:02pm
Originally posted by VietVet VietVet wrote:

Shameful to be a Republican.......heck, shameful to be any politican on either side.....and......at any level. The entire Washington scene, Columbus scene and Middletown city scene, from a political/voter/citizen standpoint, is disgusting to see, hear and read about. Is there no one in our corner on anything that is important to the people? No one listening to what we want from our governments? Empty promise liars until elected. Ignoring the people after being elected......all of them. Wish we could clean house at all levels. Problem is, the replacements are clones of the trash we took out. No getting away from the   's we elect and try to replace. All products from the same assembly line.
 
Vet is right,it is shameful to be either one,Republican or Democrat they are both sorry as* parties and one in the same with the exact same agenda,just different wording.STOP VOTING ALONG PARTY LINES !!! Middeltown and Butler County I know are big time Republicans but it needs to stop !! What has a Republican done for anyone lately ? What has a Democrat done ? Absolutely nothing !! We have had the 2 party dictatorship way to long,people say they want change,they want their cities,counties and country back then stop putting these sorry BAST***S in office ! I don't care if you decide to go with a 3rd party and what party that would be just stop voting Republican & Democrat.
No more democrats no more republicans,vote Constitution Party !!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote spiderjohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 15 2011 at 1:03pm
I believe that Council changes this fall, while any tax levy would be the following year--correct?
So--by electing the same-thinking new Councilmembers,  there would be more support towards softening any levy approach(if possible). Just trying to keep it cheap and simple.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acclaro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 15 2011 at 1:38pm
sj, I agree it would start with council as you are absolutely correct, it will be 5 years anf next year, before the tax levy, with the execption of Health, as that may appear in November.
 
I would wholeheartedly support your candidacy, and am certain would others. I believe there would be a profile to be met in any candidate. Another JL, educated, college degree, engaged in city, wants change. You may have some in mind. I know a few who fit the profile, but uncertain if they have the time.
 
Jim Wendell comes to mind, but have no idea what his interest would be. Ms. Andrew seems to acknowledge the affect of Section 8 on the schools, and doesn't mind holding the candle light to that problem and the schools. If she desired, and could handle both roles, I would be a strong advocate for her. We'll see how the re-negotiation goes this summer in the school system.
 
I have no names that would want to serve, and I have eplored with a few. I suspect the council now, would all support a levy passing with one exception, and that includes ASJ. Back to where its been every year, not certain how many JL's are around Middletown.    
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TonyB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 15 2011 at 7:01pm
I see that Hermes is a convert to my "VOTE THEM OUT" campaign although I suspect he held this belief before I posted a word on here. SJ, I believe your suggestion to simply elect candidates for council that will implement the kinds of reform advocated on this board to be the best chance for success. Getting committments from candidates and organizing a coherent campaign that will reach the voters is the challenge as I see it. Based on the apathy of the general electorate in this town and the difficulty of overcoming the deep pockets of the powers that be in this city will not be easy. The next 90 days will be crucial if any serious challenge is to take shape. Let's see what happens!!!
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