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Orman Building Demo |
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409
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Mar 27 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1014 |
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Posted: Aug 23 2012 at 11:05am |
The hoe on the left is a Kobelco SK200. The Bobcat I referenced in an earlier post is actually a Mustang.
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Mike_Presta
MUSA Council Joined: Apr 20 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3483 |
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Photo copied from 8/14/2012 Facebook post by W. Pence, showing both backhoes.
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“Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012
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Mike_Presta
MUSA Council Joined: Apr 20 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3483 |
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CHMoore, Not to nit-pick or to start an argument, but just to
clarify: There were actually TWO backhoes working this
project. The large Caterpillar and a
smaller hoe (I can’t recognize the make—see the picture on the left posted by
409 on14 Aug 2012 at 6:12pm). I haven’t done any estimating since 1996 or ’97, but back
then your hourly rate figure would’ve been too high for the smaller hoe, and
maybe about right ($150 to 200, renting by the hour) for the big Cat). Your guess for inflation since 1997 is as good as mine (and probably better, if you've been doing estimating since then). Also, the big hoe (the Cat) used a hydraulic shear, not a
bucket, part of the time. There is an additional
rental/equipment usage charge for shears and/or hydraulic rams that can run as
high as 50% of the charge for the hoe.
(Hard to believe, I know, but it is true.) This second hoe also means that another operator is needed. Finally, to be fair to the City Manager, I recall her
saying at the last council meeting that she wasn’t certain of the exact cost
but was sure that it was LESS than $50,000.
Maybe it was way less??? Let’s
wait and see—hopefully it will be less than $25,000. |
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“Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012
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chmoore1
MUSA Resident Joined: Jan 25 2012 Status: Offline Points: 230 |
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Ground/Bill: I have experience with "emergency" work. First, this wasn't really "emergency work"---they had several days to line this up. "Emergency" is, this water main broke and you need to respond within one hour, and stay on the job 24 hours a day until it is finished." Whatever it takes. Send me 10 men and let's go. By photo evidence, it started on the morning of August 14th. One hoe, one operator, one worker hosing the dust, and, perhaps, a third operating a front end loader. Apparently, whatever wasn't reclaimed (large beams) was dropped in the basement and not hauled off. Project was finished by 3:39, August 16th. No evidence of overnight work. So, hoe and operator at, say, $200.00/hr (hoe $125.00, operator $75.00/hr.) X 24 (8 X 3 days) equals $4,800. 24 hours labor for 2 other employees @ $50.00/hr. each equals $2,400. Move-in, move-out, 4 hours (generous) @ $50.00/hr. equals $200.00. Misc. materials (plastic protective fencing, etc.) say, $2,000 to be generous equals $2,000. Water for hosing, let's say $1,000 to be generous (water might even have been supplied by the city at no charge). Even if some disposal was involved, let's again be generous and say $5,000. Let's see what we have: $4,800 + $2,400 + $200.00 + $2,000 + $1,000 + $5,000 = $15,400. Yeah, that really gets close to $50,000 real fast. Can you think of anything that was left out for $35,000? Also, don't forget that the city has to have an agreement with a demolition company to respond to this type of project relatively quickly. With as many buildings as the city has demolished recently, this should have been relatively routine. Just for the sake of argument, let's up the equipment cost to $200/hr., up $75/hr. X 24 hours; add another $1,800. Total, $17,200. Uh, yeah, I did do project estimates for a number of years. chmoore
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Bill
MUSA Citizen Joined: Nov 04 2009 Status: Offline Points: 710 |
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"Still pretty high for 3 days work." Spoken like someone who has never run a business. This kind of equipment costs big time money, plus the quick, emergency service premium as mentioned above.
I wonder if the city got multiple bids and tried to negotiate. Guessing not.
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ground swat
MUSA Citizen Joined: Mar 31 2011 Status: Offline Points: 367 |
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Details......unless you do this for a living. It's expensive when you have to call on a emergency. Hauling/Dumping to clear it quickly costs $$. You want quick service you pay. This town doesn't know what pro-active means.
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chmoore1
MUSA Resident Joined: Jan 25 2012 Status: Offline Points: 230 |
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Still pretty high for 3 days work. chmoore
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Vivian Moon
MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187 |
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Ms Judy stated at last nights council meeting that City Hall paid less than $50,000 for the demo of this small section of the Orman Building. |
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409
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Mar 27 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1014 |
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In this round of demolition there was no debris disposal. With the exception of salvaging large wood beams, the debris was simply compacted with a bulldozer into the lower level. This section had wood beams instead of steel, similar to the old Sorg buildings.
This was posted above. (Bobcat carrying a large wood beam)
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John Beagle
MUSA Official Joined: Apr 23 2007 Location: Middletown Status: Offline Points: 1855 |
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Were there no steel I beams to be recycled?
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chmoore1
MUSA Resident Joined: Jan 25 2012 Status: Offline Points: 230 |
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lrisner: I agree that disposal is costly, but that isn't over $50,000 of disposal material. chmoore
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lrisner
MUSA Citizen Joined: May 26 2009 Status: Offline Points: 330 |
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Have any of you paid for disposal lately? I paid $875 for disposal of just a 1 1/2 car garage that my brothers and i tore down. Having the ability to get rid of the debris is where the cost/profit comes in.
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VietVet
MUSA Council Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008 |
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How about the MMF'ers giving the city back the $75,000 to pay for this? They're high rollers. They claim they care about the city, right? I'm sure they wouldn't mind footing the bill out of their own pockets, would they?
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chmoore1
MUSA Resident Joined: Jan 25 2012 Status: Offline Points: 230 |
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Well, wasn't that cozy? Up to $75,000. Our pictorial log started (above) on August 14th---Tuesday---and was broom clean by 3:39 Thursday, August 16th. Three days, one hoe/operator, debris removal, one guy hosing the area, three sidewalk superintendents. Not bad for $25,000 a day. How many bids did they have, again? chmoore
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Vivian Moon
MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187 |
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CORRECTION
I drove past the building and realized that only a small section had been removed so I email Russ Carlos and requested the cost of this demo.
The city paid upto $75,000 for this demo to be paid from the dowtown fund. |
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409
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Mar 27 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1014 |
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For less than 3 days work + some planning ! I've been in the wrong business !!!
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Bocephus
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jun 04 2009 Status: Offline Points: 838 |
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thats crazy |
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Vivian Moon
MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187 |
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409
I believe this demo will cost the city between $225,000 and $300,000.
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409
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Mar 27 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1014 |
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Thanx John!
This is the finished product for now. Wonder what the price tag was for this? |
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John Beagle
MUSA Official Joined: Apr 23 2007 Location: Middletown Status: Offline Points: 1855 |
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Great photos!
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Mike_Presta
MUSA Council Joined: Apr 20 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3483 |
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“Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012
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409
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Mar 27 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1014 |
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Talked to one of the guys & he said there was no asbestos in that side of the building.
This is as far back as they are going to go for now. |
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VietVet
MUSA Council Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008 |
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Could happen again in this town Bo. Back when they attempted Lake Middletown, someone in the city building (we never knew who made the decision), approved the removal of the temporary dam that separated the lake from the Great Miami River BEFORE the Army Corps Of Engineers told the city they could remove it, and the city paid a $300,000+ fine for allowing silt to be released into the river. Part of the track record this city has accululated for botched projects. If a project has disaster written all over it, look no further than the city building for the culprits. |
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chmoore1
MUSA Resident Joined: Jan 25 2012 Status: Offline Points: 230 |
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Asbestos? I don't see no stinking asbestos. chmoore
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Bocephus
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jun 04 2009 Status: Offline Points: 838 |
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I could just imagine the fines that they would invoke on this city I pray thats not the case.
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