The Hydraulic Canal....Again
Printed From: MiddletownUSA.com
Category: Middletown City Government
Forum Name: City Council
Forum Description: Discuss individual members and council as a legislative body.
URL: http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3791
Printed Date: Apr 28 2024 at 5:54pm
Topic: The Hydraulic Canal....Again
Posted By: VietVet
Subject: The Hydraulic Canal....Again
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 6:54am
|
Today's Journal....
Canal project stagnant as the smelly, mosquito-ridden water MIDDLETOWN — Repairs to the city’s defunct hydraulic canal will likely remain as stagnant as the water in it after City Council members quashed a proposal to fix the problem How many councils are going to "visit" this topic and how many times are they going to "table it" or just "wish" it would go away? "Wilbraham Road Resident Gary Barge, who has been fighting to fix the canal since the 1990s, said he thinks the repair would have helped. Residents have had to deal with odors and excessive mosquitoes as a result of the stagnant water. Many have already spent money cleaning the canal and filling in the sides to protect their backyards from being eroded" "Councilwoman Anita Scott Jones said she would “bet her paycheck” most people would not want the canal in their backyard". And because it is not in any councilperson's backyard, it will be ignored. If it were in back of Mulligan or Kohler's house in S. Main St., it would have already been taken care of. This next statement from Tom "Quiet Man" Allen is astonishing!!!! "Councilman Tom Allen said he was not in favor of rerouting Aeronca’s water. However, he encouraged Barge to pursue a solution with his neighbors, especially if they are already spending their own money to protect their backyards. “If you have 2,000 signatures and you get $2,000 a piece from (those people), you fix your problem,” he said" WHAT????? Encourage Barge to pursue a solution with his neighbors.....???What in the hell do you think they have been doing for the last ten years Allen, playin' "hippity hop at the barber shop"? What an ignorant statement to make bud. Then he follows with... “If you have 2,000 signatures and you get $2,000 a piece from (those people), you fix your problem,” he said" Yeah Allen, I would suspect most of those folks along the canal have 2 grand laying around on the kitchen table waiting to fix the city's problem. Like the city asking the residents to pave their own street with the city shirking their responsibility, now Allen wants the residents along the canal to pay for the solution to another city problem that is being ignored. Allen's a fool for even suggesting this IMO. Hey Allen, here's a clue....it isn't THEIR problem. The dam city owns the canal. It's YOUR (the city's) problem. YOU own it. YOU (the city) are in violation of the health codes with the stagnant, mosquito infested water. |
Replies:
Posted By: TonyB
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 9:09am
| Vet - here's a solution that I bet the city can really get behind. Why not just deed all of the hydraulic canal to the property owners that abut it? That way, it's no longer a city problem because the city no longer owns the land. Responsibility shirked, property owners on the hook to fix the problem and we can move on and find other areas to stick it to the citizens; like streets and curbs!!! |
Posted By: spiderjohn
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 9:52am
|
Dedicated to our Council--I missed my ward rep Mr.Allen making thecomments posted above:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M432WOIboyE - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M432WOIboyE |
Posted By: LMAO
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 10:01am
Mr.ALLEN why dont you and the rest of the spinlesss council people take a hike and get lost.Everybody dont have 2000.00 sitting around like YOU. Its the Citys problem not the residents. You spinless council people make me sick .
|
Posted By: Hermes
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 10:02am
What year did the canal stop operating and we still have it all these decades later ?!!
Stupid is as stupid does.  ------------- No more democrats no more republicans,vote Constitution Party !! |
Posted By: 409
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 11:53am
| The dam failed in 1993. It has only been 18 years! |
Posted By: 409
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 12:23pm
|
Regarding the Aeronca (Magellan) discharge:
If any discharge line were to be installed, why run it to the hydraulic anyway?
It could be run to the north on the west side of Germantown Road, pushed under Carmody Blvd and into the river. I'm not sure but I think there is a drain between Carmody and the levee to the river. Might be an option if not a problem with the FAA and airport. Also don't know at what points the "storm sewers" dump into the hydraulic.
|
Posted By: viper771
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 1:26pm
| I had no idea a part of the old canal was still around. Sorry if I sound ignorant but why is the water not flowing? Is the area in question a part of the canal that wasn't filled in? I just knew that they filled in the canal and that is where Verity is now..but I didn't know other parts were still around. I still haven't seen all of Middletown yet and I have lived here for a couple yrs now. I am still trying to get around to explore. |
Posted By: swohio75
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 1:46pm
| It's never been determined that the city own's the canal and who is utimately responsible for it. |
Posted By: Hermes
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 1:58pm
|
With standing water and possible health problems from mosquito's the health department should be stepping in to demand a solution.Where is the state health people ? Where is the federal health people ?
I'm betting if anyone of us had standing water in their backyard and mosquito's were breeding like rabbit's the health department would not stop until the home owner was in prison.
I would think since the canal runs through this town the city would be liable for it. ------------- No more democrats no more republicans,vote Constitution Party !! |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 2:03pm
viper, the portion of the hydraulic canal that is in question and presents a nuisance runs past Wilbraham Rd. and past the entryway to Smith Park on down toward the former site of Sorg Paper. Prior to the dam breaking in 1993, water flow was maintained in the canal and reduced stagnation creating mosquito breeding and health issues. Now that the dam has broken (and the state won't fix it), there is no water flow and it has become a cesspool. Studies on fixatives included installing pumps to create water flow, installing aerators to lessen stagnation.....all, too expensive for the city to implement. So, it sits there, occasionally mentioned by past and current council members and alot of money spent for "studies" with no solution in sight. Residents along Wilbraham, including Gary Barge, have complained, taken water samples, reported it to the EPA, etc. to no avail. It sits as an eyesore, a health hazard and as a monument to another city responsibility that has been ignored for many years.....like the roads, sewers, the downtown, the housing, busineses leaving town and many other issues that belong in the "turn their back, look the other way" file. |
viper771 wrote:Posted By: TonyB
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 3:03pm
|
Struck by something in the MJ article; the city manager says that what Aeronica is doing is perfectly legal, they have a valid permit and are being good corporate citizens. WTF!!! could someone explain to me: 1 How they got a permit to dump water into a canal that does not flow? If they are dumping water, shouldn't the dumped water at least be required to go somewhere? 2. How can it be legal, EPA permit or not, to create a public health hazard? 3. If they are such good corporate citizens, wouldn't they fix this problem themselves with their own capital, instead of pushing the responsibility to the city and the city putting the brunt on residents affected? I'd be interested in someone answering those questions.
|
Posted By: viper771
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 3:09pm
| Thanks for the info vet! I think I read somewhere that the water once was used for the paper mill and still flowed though the mill until the dam broke. Can there be a way to fill it in? I don't know if that would really help though. Something should have been done a long time ago, there is no doubt about that. I can see that there will more many more problems appearing in the near future that the city won't be able to ignore. |
Posted By: Mike_Presta
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 4:58pm
You speak of two distinctly separate and different canals. The Miami and Erie Canal, which once partially followed what is now Verity Parkway, was a canal actually used by canal boats for transportation and commerce, and I believe once had a total length of about 250 miles. The “Hydraulic Canal” was a much shorter canal of about three miles and not used for transportation of people or merchandise. Its purpose was to provide hydraulic power for businesses alongside its route. It branched off the Miami River near where Carmody Boulevard tees into Verity Parkway (actually closer to our million dollar bike path's northern terminus), and dumped back into that river in the area fondly referred to as “Lake Middletown” just downstream of Bicentennial Park. However, this hydraulic canal (one of many throughout the country) no longer flows and is currently used as a storm water retention basin by the City of Middletown (although they do not admit that) and for an EPA-permitted discharge by Magellan (once Aeronca Corp.) ------------- “Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012 |
Posted By: TonyB
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 5:30pm
| Hermes - you're asking where's the Federal EPA? They got defunded. |
Posted By: Mike_Presta
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 5:43pm
------------- “Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012 |
Posted By: viper771
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 6:21pm
|
Thanks for the info Mike. I was thinking they were one in the same. |
Posted By: TonyB
Date Posted: Apr 11 2011 at 8:09pm
|
MR P, You didn't actually think that defunding meant actually reducing costs, did you? I'm sure wherever the defunding went, they'll find the money somewhere else to keep paying salaries; kinda like our own city!!!
|
Posted By: Mike_Presta
Date Posted: Apr 12 2011 at 4:05am
Frankly, I think some local people who actually know better try to foster that belief, perhaps because they harbor the hope that they will be commisssioned to "restore" a portion of the hydraulic canal to inaccurately represent it with canal boats, and possibly a set of locks, without regards to historic accuracy. I have no idea how they think this could possibly ever get past the keen eye for detail of our Historic Commission.   ------------- “Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012 |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Apr 12 2011 at 8:48pm
| Ahhh, that Historic Commission.....that group of historians who have managed to take George Crout's donation to the history of this town from around a million when he died, to around $200,000 now?....and can't account for the money spent? Or so I'm told. |
Posted By: TonyB
Date Posted: Apr 12 2011 at 9:42pm
|
Frankly, I think some local people who actually know better try to foster that belief, perhaps because they harbor the hope that they will be commisssioned to "restore" a portion of the hydraulic canal to inaccurately represent it with canal boats, and possibly a set of locks, without regards to historic accuracy. I have no idea how they think this could possibly ever get past the keen eye for detail of our Historic Commission. Mr Presta, You sir, are a genius! What could possibly be better than to float thru the new "Venice" of SW Ohio, the new arts crown jewel of the Miami Valley!!! If we can't draw people downtown with gondola rides thru the historic downtown sites and sounds (and smells)then there's just no hope for this town!!! This sounds like one of those ideas that should be acted quickly upon by our intrepid folks at MMF! That is their purpose, to be the economic development engine in our city. Who cares if it's historically accurate, it will be in a hundred years from now anyway!!!
|
Posted By: TonyB
Date Posted: Apr 12 2011 at 10:26pm
| some day I'll figure out how to quote someone with the little box. Yeah, right!!! |
Posted By: Mike_Presta
Date Posted: Apr 12 2011 at 10:42pm
|
[QUOTE=TonyB]Mr Presta,
You sir, are a genius!... [QUOTE] Of course I am  ...and humble, too!!!  ------------- “Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012 |
Posted By: Mike_Presta
Date Posted: Apr 12 2011 at 10:44pm
------------- “Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012 |
Posted By: wannaknow
Date Posted: Apr 19 2011 at 11:41pm
| The city could have filled in the canal with the debris from all the buildings they've torn down. The rubble from the old Middletown Hospital and all the schools they tore down would have provided a lot of fill-in. Why did Gary Barge stop fighting? We need him here in Ward 1. Do you think Mr. Allen even knows where this ward is located? |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Apr 20 2011 at 6:14am
|
wannaknow- don't know that Gary has stopped fighting. Might be in a lull for now. He has talked to city leaders about this situation for years. They passify him with some studies and recommendations and the subject goes away until he confronts them again. It is discussed, apparently as a gesture to the Wilbraham residents to silence them each time. Alot of money has been spent on "studies and recommendations" but no real action has been taken by the city. Like alot of other issues brought before them, they use the old "passify, act concerned, then ignore" routine. Most seem not to care about attacking real problems, just talk them to death. JMO
Allen lives in the ward. He's a college educated boy and an attorney. I would hope that qualifies him to find out where the ward is that he represents, although sometimes I wonder if any of the Four Horsemen of the Apocalyse knows their butt from first base. |
Posted By: LMAO
Date Posted: Apr 20 2011 at 9:24am
| I dont know that he has stopped. The spineless ones are just passing the buck and doesnt care since it isnt in there back yard.As in Mr.Allen,have to agree with Vet,another one that dont know his butt from a hole in the ground.Got the postion cos he has buddies.. |