COMBINED SEWERS
Printed From: MiddletownUSA.com
Category: Middletown City Government
Forum Name: Engineering
Forum Description: City Engineering Department
URL: http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5429
Printed Date: Apr 19 2024 at 3:36pm
Topic: COMBINED SEWERS
Posted By: Vivian Moon
Subject: COMBINED SEWERS
Date Posted: Aug 21 2013 at 10:14am
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After watching the presentation of the new 300 million dollar Separation Sewer Plan required by EPA at last night council meeting I only have one question…. |
Replies:
Posted By: LMAO
Date Posted: Aug 21 2013 at 10:57am
| Wasted on "PET" projects. |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Aug 21 2013 at 11:03am
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City Hall Magic with the past/present Finance Directors as the magicians. Money is collected. Money is placed in the intended area in the budget. Money is moved, at a later date, to the General Fund where it loses it's intended purpose and identity. Money is funneled into other areas of interest like the downtown spectacle, special property purchases and salaries for friends of the city. Likewise, what happened to the gas tax money intended for the streets the last three decades? (See above format for money flow) The old switcherroo with nothing under any choice in the old shell game. Watch closely, as they are pros at making once visible money disappear. ------------- I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over. |
Posted By: over the hill
Date Posted: Aug 21 2013 at 11:51am
| Hey, Les why don't you remind them of their "fiduciary responsibility" to other people's money??? |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 08 2013 at 9:21am
| So.......You people have never pulled money from your savings account to pay for an emergency.............Or maybe you budgeted entertainment at one price and car expense at other................Then your transmission/engine/brakes/tires failed, did you maintain the same budget? In a perfect world, budgets work...... |
Posted By: ktf1179
Date Posted: Nov 08 2013 at 9:25am
| It's not the transferring of funds that is the issue, it is what they have been spending it on that has been the issue. |
Posted By: acclaro
Date Posted: Nov 08 2013 at 10:54am
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I am anything but a conspiratist, a thought provoking person thinking the government is behind all events that occur. Indeed, Most people are factual, pragmatic, and reasonable minded individuals. If one reviews the history of Middletown, its history of corruption is rather startling to say the least. There is wire tapping in the jail over hearing attorney/ client communication, there is money spent insanely with no return nor logical explanation downtown when a former city manager said the downtown was dead and city council members, doing an about face, there are payments of $75,000 to a small group of people aka MMF with no non profit disclosure nor filing at the state level, there are mis-statements (being diplomatic like the NY Times), that a former city manager stated repeated even at 25% reserve, that left the city only at 90 days to service its obligations; yet, for the past few years, its been dropped to 15%, with no mention that if a major unexpected event occurred, it would leave the city with a month cash reserve. Who is lying; former city manager or current city manager and council? We heard annually, just like state, budget has to be balanced, yet, I have been reading Mayor Mulligan states the city has at least one year, perhaps, two, we are running a negative balance and deficit. This is a violation of the ordinance and Ohio's municipal statutes. Les Landon states routinely in winter, the city has no compensatory obligation to repair a broken car part from a pothole, or other damage; yet, a major northeastern city early winter 2013, lost a judgment for damage and bodily harm in the $ Mm range, about 4 Mm to be exact. Now, the issue of collection of money for services to be used specifically just like public safety, is altered and not accounted. While one can move your own personal finances into one account to another, you are ABSOLUTELY incorrect, it is legal to do so in a municipality. Same goes for collection of funds, for one purpose, and used for another. I am MORE concerned money is misappropriated and unaccounted, than what it is used for. The ends DO NOT justify the means. My gosh, a woman pulls out a campaign application a month before its due, and blows out two seasoned sitting council members. I believe many, on face, discount the seriousness of the irregularities that occur in Middletown quite commonly. There will be a battle on double charge on street lights; make no mistake.
------------- 'An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.' - Winston Churchill |
Posted By: over the hill
Date Posted: Nov 08 2013 at 10:56am
| HdM:did you read the above post by VietVet. That pretty much sums up what's been happening in city council. |
Posted By: Justsayin
Date Posted: Nov 08 2013 at 9:29pm
| Look, Judy's boyfriend (Sam) is a life long Middletown artist who's dream has been to make downtown an art mecca. Ann Mort is Sam's life long best friend. The M-twins are friends of Sam and Mort. Money is spent downtown like a drunken sailor. Mort and the Mulligans rubber stamps whatever Sam and Queen Judy want. How many times has the queen remodeled her office over the last several years and at what cost? All the worthless buildings? Art buildings? Why is Greg Pratt constantly hired by Judy instead of using the city attorney? At what cost? The list goes on and on. The whole setup is a sorry shame at the expense of everyone in this town. It is pathetic. Wake up Middletown! Get rid of these people! |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 7:51am
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I think you worry about too much......Legal , illegal......Come on, there is an affirmative defense to most "illegal" actions... The end don't justify the means.......................So the end result is to supply the citizens public services, Ok great. You basically saying that the city doesn't have the authority to move money as needed.........So if we collect and allocate money for street lights and something happens to the water supply infrastructure, then we just have lights at night but no water supplied to residents...................Yea that sounds like a plan .. Sure on the surface if you look you will see corruption like processes............But has anyone ever dug deep and found the real reasons for the conspiracies that most are implying.... Don't get me wrong, I believe in an open government for all to see and question, decisions by those in charge are made with all the facts/opinions available to them... Those on outside question and apply their opinions hindsight and mostly without all the opinions and facts.... Like the supposedly wiretapping on an attorney/client in jail, do you know for a fact there wasn't a federal investigation in place allowing such an activity ? Bottomline , you have had water/sewer, roads to drive on, street lights, civil/criminal courts, fire, police and EMT services trash pickup and snow removal for at least 50 years .............So exactly what is your complaint..?
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Posted By: Vivian Moon
Date Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 10:10am
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HdMechanical - I think you worry about too much......Legal , illegal......Come on, there is an affirmative defense to most "illegal" actions... The end don't justify the means.......................So the end result is to supply the citizens public services, Ok great. You basically saying that the city doesn't have the authority to move money as needed.........So if we collect and allocate money for street lights and something happens to the water supply infrastructure, then we just have lights at night but no water supplied to residents...................Yea that sounds like a plan .. Sure on the surface if you look you will see corruption like processes............But has anyone ever dug deep and found the real reasons for the conspiracies that most are implying.... Don't get me wrong, I believe in an open government for all to see and question, decisions by those in charge are made with all the facts/opinions available to them... Those on outside question and apply their opinions hindsight and mostly without all the opinions and facts.... Like the supposedly wiretapping on an attorney/client in jail, do you know for a fact there wasn't a federal investigation in place allowing such an activity ? HdMechanical Sign in under your real name and we shall have a full discussion about the past actions of the City Hall and where all this money has gone….millions and millions of dollars. I’m more than willing to tell you exactly what my complaint is. WARNING…the old farts in this community DO REMEMBER why these charges were approved so many years ago. |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 10:14am
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Actually HdMechanical is my real name.......or shall we say my business name....I have no fear of using my name since I do on several other forums, a simple search on Ohio 's business gateway website for HdMechanical will yield the results you want or need... Steve Poff
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Posted By: spiderjohn
Date Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 10:40am
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welcome HDM/whomever--your input is appreciated the wiretapping incidents were widespread and absolutely illegal maybe a fed case somewhere but few and far between u r defending the in-defensible there would be interesting to list any out-of-court $$ settlements there city fund-shifting? wouldn't be such an issue if the city WAS shifting funds openly to where they are actually needed to benefit the entire community--however "they" are moving money from dedicated areas into ?able and expensive property purchases followed by insider giveaways of the same properties + large $$s of re-hab cash---money taken from the city taxpayers to be given to multi-millionares who promise the moon and seldom deliver. If the city put conditions and requirements on these giveaways, then we might get better, quicker more meaningful results imo. BUT-- our govt. gives it away with no such guarantees or timetables. Pendleton being a prime example--the Rose Building, First National and Masonic lately and the Manchester coming up shortly. These large commercial properties used to pay substantial property taxes and house numerous mid/upper income taxpaying employees. Now we have next to none of either. And ALL in the same area with most of the recipients intertwined into the city inner circle. It would be very telling to read a graph/chart showing 40 years of expenditures/giveaways in our area formerly known as downtown, and the results as to jobs created, payrolls, retail/service sales and income/property taxes paid. You might be very surprised and better understand the concerns. The rest of the city has been abandoned, other than haphazard property demos(long overdue) in order to fill requirements for using fed grant $$. We already have enough green space and brownfields/grayfields imo. Drive around our city--particularly from Baltimore St up to Supthin and in Ward 2. More properties that are now not going to produce property tax OR be useful. The recent local elections solved little. Despite bold election time promises, no $$$ still =s no $$$, how the public safety fix will be handled should prove interesting. Can't wait to hear ?Mr.Picard's and Mrs.Bronston's solutions. We now know that tax increases won't fly with voters, especially for public safety where we have been burned twice just in the last decade. An accounting of that tax $$(along with the sewer funding) might prove enlightening. dig a little deeper------ jmo
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Posted By: Perplexed
Date Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 1:03pm
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Spider - Thank you for re-emphasizing my previous comments about haphazard residential demolition being carried out by Mr. Akins and staff in portions of Ward 2. Many other MUSA participants need to drive down Baltimore, Crawford, Young, Garfield, Sutphin, etc. I agree that this demolition derby will have a negative impact on those properties remaining. Once again, there's a complete lack of project planning and analysis by the so-called Community Revitalization experts. In June 2008 it was Paul Renwick, President of the Middletown Board of REALTORS who cautioned Queen Judith that any residential demolition plans in Ward 2 must be well thought out. This was said during a heated exchange of the City Council Housing Subcommittee that was attended by six members of the Community Development Advisory Committee that was summarily scuttled in late 2008. I never saw Miss Gilleland so red-faced. After all, us commoners were never ever to disagree with her. And, it was the Doogmeister who said that there wasn't any real need for the Advisory Committee as his actions were well monitored by HUD, Queen Judy, City Council and the Middletown Journal. Queen Judy and Judge Doogie are cut from the same cloth. Such a shame for Middletown.
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Posted By: Vivian Moon
Date Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 5:23pm
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Well Mr. Poff I must say I’m shocked that you are a business owner and that you approve of City Hall raiding about 250 million dollars of the sewer separation funds for other items in the budget over the years. City Hall has robbed, raided, and raped every fund as they have tried to balance the budget over the years as the revenues diminished and the population declined each year…however the salaries of City Hall, Fire and Police continue to increase. City Halls last brilliant decision to increase the population, fill the empty housing stock, fill the schools and revenues for the city coffer was HUD’s Section 8 Program.…now City Hall wants to put these landlords out of business. City Hall has robbed Peter, Paul and Mary and within the next two years the City of The only thing left for the citizens of |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 6:56pm
No one likes it, They done what they thought was necessary....Was it right , legal or illegal? Who as citizens has the time, resources or information to go back and right a wrong? Sometimes it is best to let an entity go broke. The police and fire increases are governed by union contracts (that is another story), the salaries of city employees are governed by contracts also... The only thing left to stop feeding the beast. I agree, thus the reason I vote against school levies. One would hope they would try different avenues to secure funding...... Or you could try bringing the beast down, one horn at a time. Fighting a corrupt system with the same corrupt system is useless. If you can single out the infected horn, then you have your first target. United they stand , divided they fall. Zoom in on your target, bring their private and public life out in the open ..Question every decision, vote , and every penny they receive. Follow them around like the paparazzi. Let them commit political suicide or your information, politically assassinates them. Change the game, they have become comfortable with the rules. Maybe we need a WatchDog group in this area........Past is past , look to the future with lessons from the past. Shocked about them raiding the SS, not really...........So far the Police, Fire and EMTs are responding and doing what they do. My water runs and the toilet flushes, I am able to file small claim suits at the court. I fish in the city park with my children. The roads are pretty clear after snow falls, and some are even getting repairs.....Been ongoing for 50 years. What else are you wanting from your city...? Articulate a concern which can be addressed, can be righted and will benefit the citizens of Middletown....What is the first step in your eyes ? Just brainstorming......
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Vivian Moon wrote:Posted By: over the hill
Date Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 8:57pm
| Step one get rid of Gilleland followed by Adkins then Kohler. Elect another mayor that doesn't have the name Mulligan probably send Landen packing too. That's a start IMO |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 09 2013 at 11:26pm
Why?
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Posted By: Bocephus
Date Posted: Nov 10 2013 at 12:54am
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No use to resist any more, Middletown is broke and will soon be the sh*t hole that the city leader have strived for over the years. Only thing left to do is cut ones losses and get the hell out of dodge jmo. That is unless you belong to the ritzy downtown crowd which I'm sure will thrive in their self created (with money that they stole from other uses) lala land. |
Posted By: ktf1179
Date Posted: Nov 10 2013 at 6:34am
The only way people in Middletown are going to wake up is when people get tired of being screwed, ignored, and they see their taxes going up. Just like the Health Care Law, people are now realizing the they have been lied too, and they are now starting to take action.
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Posted By: Vivian Moon
Date Posted: Nov 10 2013 at 10:37am
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What is the first step in your eyes ?
If this was a company that I had purchased I would do the following within the first 7 days: |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 10 2013 at 11:50am
Why , what are the benefits ? You want change, you have to be able to articulate why. In case you have not noticed this city budget thing and school funding issues are ongoing in almost every city across the nation..... So, you think wages of city employees should collectively be 60% of gross yearly revenues or net yearly revenues ....You still have equipment maintenance , overhead and supplies. Do you consider employee health benefits/ retirement packages a wage or an extra unneeded cost ? Just curious, have you actually run the numbers on the costs of raising a family and supplying them with the needed resources to grow up and become a fully vested member of the community ? Education, proper healthcare, proper eating habits, a clean and maintained home. Plus the parents having enough income left over to invest for their retirement, so they do not become a burden on society in the latter years.. Fire at will..............
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Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 10 2013 at 12:03pm
When you need extra money at home......You cut corners or increase household income.........If right now the city had all top level management work for free, cut all staffing 20% across the board............Guess what, at current and projected future revenue increases..........They will be in the same boat, in 3 years. So which is it, cut costs or increase revenue.......?
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Posted By: spiderjohn
Date Posted: Nov 10 2013 at 12:26pm
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pretty tough to do either at this time a real problem your prior post goes WAY beyond city issues, bringing in separate personal situations they really don't mix, though both must be considered what are your solutions hdm? It can't continue as it is trending--and there is no additionl revenue to tap in to tax increases are not feasible--public has no extra $$, and local govt is not a good shepard of public funds like the schools--no amount is enough govt is still the problem more than the solution look no further than the former downtown... the roi from decades of municipal investment is negligible the only moves coforward have come recently from private investment/businesses you talk in circles, downplaying legit local(also national/global) concerns, and rationalizing govt waste how do you want to control the beast or make it work better for the totality?
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Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 10 2013 at 1:05pm
You are correct, this is not a single point issue.......You must understand the problem to fix it. This did not happen overnight. We are all looking for solutions, I research and engage on forums to collectively brainstorm... I constantly see people put blame on local governments for mis handling ......Sure there is waste, everywhere is waste, I can find waste in your budget....But with proper control, that waste can be overcome provided the resources are available.. In business we rely on the public to spend money....Governments rely on the public to make money and spend money, when either one takes a hit ,the government is scrambling for revenues. It is a vicious circle, Government pumps $80 million into butler county via food stamps ...Who benefits? To us a Nickle increase means little, take that nickle away from an entity that rely on that nickle a billion times .....You will have Chaos. Jobs, is the overall answer.......Period. Right now the cities are being shutdown by those who vote , because they are feeling the pinch and seeing no changes. Cities are throwing their hands in the air and moving money around to survive. After a few years and no increase in revenues, with no excess to store back.......The scramble has began, you will not need to worry about cuts to city services they will get done and they will hope revenues increase soon .....But like last time, No increase and cuts will happen again.. Mergers will on the horizon , either complete cities or services. Pretty soon we will start seeing more and more multi generation households and that will add to the tax revenues problems. More and more citizens are becoming self-reliant , going green and using less services/products which the government has based their revenues on.... Citizens cutting costs = Governments in the red.......... |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 10 2013 at 1:37pm
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Give ya a little insight to my MindSet.............Afterall 80% of my ramblings are becoming reality |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 10 2013 at 2:08pm
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Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 10 2013 at 2:15pm
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Should you be bored enough to read the rest of the above thread............Linking to TrentonTalk is easier then copy and pasting the whole thread.... |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 10 2013 at 4:48pm
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If SNAP is in-fluxing $80 million per year into Butler County via 3800 eligible persons....And there are 45 million persons in the program nationwide...Just exactly where is this money coming from? 7% in the USA are receiving those benefits, approx 2 million in Ohio. Not only are they receiving funds which could be used elsewhere, They are not contributing to the local tax base at the desired rate. If any thing keeping the salaries and jobs up on your city employees could possibly help stimulate and maintain the local economy...Cut the salaries or jobs of your public sector and watch another class start cutting corner and not spending money, ....See the vicious circle.. The worse that you can do is keep contributing to the circle by cutting jobs.......... Cutting costs and cutting jobs are two different things. |
Posted By: tomahawk35
Date Posted: Nov 11 2013 at 12:00am
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Governments in black
Citzen living in cardboard boxes
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Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 14 2013 at 2:18pm
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Typical response from KeyBoard Commandos..............Nothing. You gripe , whine, cry, whatever you want to call it and not one of ya can articulate a good reason with proof or documentation of why one person is better than another. There is no magic mayor, city manager or council member that will change the past mistakes. It takes a group effort to clean up a mess which has gotta out of hand, sure you gripe and want heads to roll........But yet you offer no viable solutions, because most do not understand the workings of how your tax base and local governments are used and funded. You have to understand "why" to truly fix a problem or the only thing you will accomplish is to react and fight the symptoms, wasting money. Middletown has took some major hits to the tax revenue in the last few years. I bet most on here who are quick to judge , cannot even name the major players which are gone....Middletown also has too many "tax exempt" properties. They need to lean toward infrastructure which the people are using....
Criticizing is easy; solutions are hard. |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Nov 14 2013 at 3:29pm
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[QUOTE=HdMechanical] Typical response from KeyBoard Commandos..............Nothing. You gripe , whine, cry, whatever you want to call it and not one of ya can articulate a good reason with proof or documentation of why one person is better than another. There is no magic mayor, city manager or council member that will change the past mistakes. It takes a group effort to clean up a mess which has gotta out of hand, sure you gripe and want heads to roll........But yet you offer no viable solutions, because most do not understand the workings of how your tax base and local governments are used and funded. You have to understand "why" to truly fix a problem or the only thing you will accomplish is to react and fight the symptoms, wasting money. Middletown has took some major hits to the tax revenue in the last few years. I bet most on here who are quick to judge , cannot even name the major players which are gone....Middletown also has too many "tax exempt" properties. They need to lean toward infrastructure which the people are using.... Ok HD, I'll offer some comments here to your post......let's take it step by step.... "Nothing. You gripe , whine, cry, whatever you want to call it and not one of ya can articulate a good reason with proof or documentation of why one person is better than another" FOR STARTERS, NOT SURE I UNDERSTAND YOUR COMMENT ON ONE PERSON BEING BETTER THAN ANOTHER. "There is no magic mayor, city manager or council member that will change the past mistakes" ACTUALLY, THE CURRENT "MAGIC" MAYOR, CITY MANAGER AND COUNCIL ARE NOT TRYING TO CHANGE THE PAST MISTAKES. RATHER, THEY ARE MERELY ADDING TO THE LIST OF PAST MISTAKES WITH THEIR OWN CONTRIBUTIONS IN GUIDING THIS CITY ON THE WRONG PATH TO CORRECT IT. IMO, THEY HAVE ACTUALLY ADDED TO THE POOR DECISIONS OF THE PAST 4 DECADES HERE. JUST PUTTING THEIR OWN BRAND ON A TOWN WITH A BAD REPUTATION, NO JOB GROWTH, LOW-INCOME THEME, QUESTIONABLE INTERNAL OPERATIONS WITHIN THE CITY GOVERNMENT, INCLUSIVE FOR A SMALL CONTINGENT WHILE BEING EXCLUSIVE FOR THE MAJORITY LIVING HERE, AND, IN, GENERAL, A SHELL OF THE TOWN IT ONCE WAS WHEN I WAS IN HIGH SCHOOL IN THE 60'S. "It takes a group effort to clean up a mess which has gotta out of hand" YES, AGREE, IT DOES TAKE A GROUP EFFORT AND WE "GRIPERS" WOULD LOVE TO PARTICIPATE AND OFFER OUR SOLUTIONS TO THE FOLKS IN DECISION-MAKING POSITIONS, BUT WE ARE NOT LISTENED TO. WE ARE IGNORED WHEN WE TRY TO TALK TO THEM DURING CITIZENS COMMENTS IN COUNCIL MEETINGS. FURTHERMORE, AND AN IMPORTANT ISSUE......OTHER THAN JOSH LAUBACH, WHO ON COUNCIL HAS HAD A COMMUNITY MEETING WHERE THE PEOPLE GET TO INTERACT AND ASK QUESTIONS AND OFFER IDEAS WITH THEIR COUNCILPEOPLE? DID MORT, PICARD OR THE TWO MULLIGANS OFFER ANY OPPORTUNITIES FOR US TO MEET WITH THEM AND TALK? NOPE. NOT ONE MEETING SINCE OLD LARRY MULLIGAN SAT BEHIND THAT COUNCIL DESK. HE IS NOT INTERESTED IN HEARING FROM US. DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHY WE HOLD PEOPLE LIKE THAT WITH DISDAIN? EVEN A SNAKE BITES BACK IF YOU STEP ON IT ONCE TOO OFTEN. HE IGNORES US. WE REACT. "But yet you offer no viable solutions, because most do not understand the workings of how your tax base and local governments are used and funded. You have to understand "why" to truly fix a problem or the only thing you will accomplish is to react and fight the symptoms, wasting money." BUT WE DO KNOW HOW THIS GOVERNMENT WORKS AND HOW IT IS FUNDED. AS EVIDENCE, I OFFER PAST POSTS FROM VERY INFORMED PEOPLE WHO HAVE LIVED IN THIS CITY FOR DECADES.....OR ALL OF THEIR LIVES AND HAVE SEEN THE GOOD, THE BAD AND THE UGLY. WE HAVE OFFERED SOLUTIONS.....ONES BASED ON FACTS, RESEARCH AND LOGIC.....TO NO AVAIL. THEY DON'T WANT TO HEAR US Hd. OH, AND WE ARE TOTALLY AWARE OF THE MONEY WASTED IN THIS CITY, NOT TO MENTION THE SHIFTING OF FUNDS FROM ONE SOURCE TO ANOTHER TO "SUDDENLY" FIND MONETARY RESOURCES TO ACCOMPLISH THEIR LITTLE PET PROJECTS WHILE CLAIMING TO BE CASH STRAPPED AS GILLELAND HAS DONE IN THE PAST. "Middletown has took some major hits to the tax revenue in the last few years" YOU DON'T HAVE TO TELL ANY OF US. SOME OF US WERE HERE IN THE 50'S AND 60'S WHEN THE PAPER MILLS AND ARMCO WAS GOING STRONG. WHEN ARMCO HAD 9000 EMPLOYEES AND HAD A HAND IN MOST EVERYTHING GOING ON IN THE CITY. SOME OF US REMEMBER A VERY VIBRANT DOWNTOWN SO FULL OF PEOPLE ON A SATURDAY YOU HAD TO WALK IN THE STREET BECAUSE THERE WAS NOT ENOUGH ROOM ON THE SIDEWALKS. I WAS ON HAND WHEN MUM WAS BEING BUILT HAVING A SUMMER JOB PLACING DESKS IN LOGAN JOHNSON HALL AND GARDNER-HARVEY LIBRARY. THE TOWN WAS ALIVE BACK THEN......SO MUCH MORE HEALTHY THAN NOW. LAST FEW YEARS???? TRY THE LAST 4 DECADES. "I bet most on here who are quick to judge , cannot even name the major players which are gone." OH, HOW ABOUT BILL DONHAM. HOW ABOUT RON OLSEN. HOW ABOUT BILL BECKER AND FRED "I HELPED PUT IN THE CITY CENTRE MALL" SENNETT AND HIS OTHER 70'S COUNCIL MEMBERS. HOW ABOUT THE CREW OF CITY COMMISSIONERS THAT SCREWED UP LAKE MIDDLETOWN AND BICENTENNIAL COMMONS AND COST THE CITY $350,000 IN FINES FROM THE ARMY CORPS OF ENGINEERS FOR ILLEGALLY REMOVING THE DAM AND RELEASING SILT OUT IN THE RIVER? ON THE GOOD SIDE, HOW ABOUT BILL KLOSTERMAN, THE CITY ENGINEER, WHO HAD ALL THE BOULEVARD SYSTEMS PUT IN TO MAKE GETTING AROUND TOWN MUCH EASIER? GOOD CITY MANAGER BACK THEN. GOOD DECISIONS BENEFITTING ALL CITIZENS, NOT A SELECT FEW BACK THEN TOO. AND HERE'S ONE FOR THE FUTURE FOR YA....HOW ABOUT THE CURRENT CITY COUNCIL. MEMBERS LIKE LARRY MULLIGAN, THE OTHER MULLIGAN, DAN PICARD, ANN MORT, ANITA SCOTT-JONES AND, AT TIMES, JOSH LAUBACH, WHO KEPT APPROVING MILLIONS TO THROW INTO A DOWNTOWN THAT WILL PROBABLY NEVER REACH THE PINNACLE OF HEIGHT THEY EXPECT IT TO. THE GIVAWAYS OF TAXPAYER MONEY. THE PROPERTY PURCHASES WITH TAXPAYER MONEY. THE FAVORITISM, THE NEGLECT OF 90% OF THE CITY AT THE EXPENSE OF THE DOWNTOWN DREAM THEY ALL HAVE. WHY? THIS WILL JOIN THE FAILURE LIST IN YEARS TO COME IT IS ALL ABOUT BEING MIS-FOCUSED AND NOT HAVING A CLUE WHAT THIS TOWN NEEDS NOR WHAT THE PEOPLE ARE ALL ABOUT. THE PEOPLE IN THE CITY BUILDING AND SITTING BEHIND THE COUNCIL DESK ARE JUST SIMPLY OUT OF TOUCH WITH REALITY AS TO THE CITY'S SITUATION. WE ARE CASH STRAPPED AND SO DESPERATE FOR REVENUE THAT THE CITY LEADERS INVITED SECTION 8/LOW INCOME TO TOWN TO GAIN HUD MONEY RATHER THAN TO DO IT THROUGH NEW JOBS AND CORPORATE TAXES. FOR ANY FAMILY (OR CITY) BUDGET, THAT MEANS YOU ELIMINATE THE EXTRAS AND FOCUS ON THE BASICS FOR NOW....UNTIL YOU CAN BUILD UP THE REVENUES......THEN YOU START ADDING ICING TO THE CAKE...SLOWLY, BUT YOU HAVE TO PROVIDE THE BASICS FIRST...IE-WATER, SEWER, DECENT ROADS, POLICE, FIRE. SAFETY FOR THE PEOPLE. PAY THE NECESSARY CITY BILLS AND PLACE WHATEVER REMAINS IN A FUND FOR CITY EMERGENCIES. AND THAT DOESN'T MEAN SENDING IT TO DREAMLAND PET PROJECTS EITHER! MY OFFERING. ------------- I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over. |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 15 2013 at 1:06pm
| Interesting....One might say, hopefully we can continue this later...........I have become busy at work and one must get it, while it is there....Hopefully a solution will crop up before I return, but we all know different even though we have conflicting views.. |
Posted By: tomahawk35
Date Posted: Nov 15 2013 at 11:58pm
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Posted By: tomahawk35
Date Posted: Nov 16 2013 at 12:35am
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Please don't try to insult people with comments like keyboard commados like you are all knowledgeable about every aspect of the workings of the government. I have worked for the government for over 20 yrs. The real truth is the government takes care of its own and doesn't care about the rest of us no matter what they say, a spade is a spade. If there is nothing to gain then you are out of luck and as far as being a solution good luck. I see this every day at work and that's the way it was when I started and it will be like that way after I leave this world. |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 16 2013 at 12:19pm
Interesting......But to be honest , I really never said much about knowing the workings of the government, I am bringing to light the funding of the government entities and how it affects people, public or private....We all know, they are about self-preservation regardless of outcome.. People really do not understand the reasoning behind some government decisions............. We have the ability to go 100% solar power, 100% recycled waste water at each residence, each vehicle has the ability to run on NG or propane........Any of those options blur the line of traditional funding for governments, Less consumer spending equals less taxbase funding.... Imagine never having another water bill or electric bill, imagine the uproar of your local government when your slash those costs.........No more revenue from those services. Some communities that have given hospitals tax exempt property status to build in their locale are now considering adding a tax per bed . Same for hope houses and other non-profits... Middletown must create jobs, regardless of whether min wage or above..........This assures that the support services do not leave, IE: doctors, lawyers, realtors, eateries, dealerships, stores, etc..... Some companies, I included have gambled on Middletown's future to prosper we have used the economy turndown to better our infrastructure and position ourselves for the upswing.....Just hope the wait isn't much longer
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Posted By: Pacman
Date Posted: Nov 17 2013 at 10:41am
Mr. Poff; Concerning your above quote and just out of curiosity... Who is going to feed the education beast if the citizens whose children use the education system Do Not? Do you have a source that will provide $40M in School Building funds if the citizens agree to pay the $55M balance on $95M? Personally I know of No One that will cough up $40M for the city of Middletown to build it's schools. No person or Organization. It makes little sense to me to throw away $40M of State Funds thus making the Middletown Citizens responsible for the total $95M if and when they come to their senses and decide they need new schools. Pacman  |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Nov 17 2013 at 11:49am
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Hd Mechanical: "Middletown must create jobs, regardless of whether min wage or above" Disagree with "regardless of whether min wage or above" statement.... Middletown has a disproportionate number of min wage jobs now. Too many fast food/ low wage industrial park/ cashier/ waitress/ mini-mart jobs and not enough medical/ high tech industrial/ "professional" level paying jobs offered here. That's why many, including myself, leave town each day and get on I-75 to go out of town to work. Nothing to chose from here that will provide a decent standard of living. ------------- I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over. |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Nov 17 2013 at 12:06pm
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"It makes little sense to me to throw away $40M of State Funds thus making the Middletown Citizens responsible for the total $95M if and when they come to their senses and decide they need new schools. Pacman" Sorry Pac. I'm on the other side of the fence when talking about school support. Not logical to throw away more taxpayer money through a bond levy to build more new schools for this district when we haven't seen much improvement from the new elementary, 45 million dollar bond levy. The school people must show that the investment made years ago was worth it before we give them more of our money. To date, hasn't happened IMO. The logic that we must approve more money because now is our only chance to "put in 40 million to get 55 million from the state" seems to be the reason of choice for people like Ms. Andrew, the levy supporters and yourself. To me, it sounds like that is the only reason to approve the levy, rather than have this middle school be a benefit to the district AS TO IMPROVING OPERATIONS, IMPROVING THE OVERALL PERFORMANCE OR BENEFITING THE COMMUNITY. The levy supporters can't use that reasoning because it hasn't happened as yet and they know it. It appears the overwhelming reason to support the levy, suggested by the pro-levy people, is that we must approve this bond levy just because the state is offering to pay for more than half, and if we don't use it we lose it. Sounds desperate to me. IMO, THAT is a misdirected reason and doesn't attack the real reasons for the stagnated performance. New schools DO NOT NECESSARILY MEAN A BETTER DISTRICT NOR RESULTS AND HAS BEEN PROVEN WITH THE NEW ELEMENTARY SCHOOL REPORT CARD. They have not made enough progress to have made the investment seem worth it. JMO ------------- I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over. |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 17 2013 at 11:20pm
Personally , I no longer debate school levies I just vote "No"...... The funding has already been ruled unconstitutional and they snub their noses at us , and continue to hold their hands out while doing nothing to cut costs. Today's technology is there to dramatically cut public school costs.....Even the schools today are using "YouTube Videos" to teach math. I have home schooled 5 children, I have had my children in the public school....I have 3 computers on the way here Thursday from ECOT .... Our plan established a strong foundation in reading and math during early childhood home school and let them finish up in the public school system if they wanted to. There are Pros and Cons to both choices... Al I can say .........If you have children, whichever choice you make do not allow them to shortcut reading and math skills.. 4 hrs a week strengthening those skills is a small investment in your child's future and if you leave their education to someone else you have no one else to blame but YOU if they fail. But back on topic............ Who is going to feed the education beast if the citizens whose children use the education system Do Not? Your ^^^^^^^^ quote above is the the problem in a nutshell, do you realize the bulk of the children who use the education system is not supported by the parents of those children. Only property owners supply the funding for schools. Businesses and personal thru property tax and some screwed up kilowatt tax on electric companies. I favor additional taxes , provided everyone pays the same...I would rather property taxes be abolished and taxes placed on consumables across the board.....Electric use, water use , Internet, phone, garbage ETC.....Oh did you know there is a $1 per tire tax on tire sold in Ohio...... The school funding or really any government funding must be applied across the board to be effective long term.....Payroll taxes are fine if everyone is working, the loss of local tax thru 1099 workers and cash/undertable workers is tremendous. property tax if everyone owned property. Sales and use tax is the closest I believe we will ever come to having consistent funding for any public entity. Even if there is no jobs, people still use certain services. Even if they move in with a relative due to hardship the use of those services increase in the household , not much but better than nothing as now. Plus we catch those off the grid workers for cash in that net... |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 17 2013 at 11:30pm
The cost to educate young people across the state is significant and those costs continue to rise. More Ohio tax dollars are spent for primary and secondary education than for any other single governmental function. The complexities of school finance practically require that taxpayers have the equivalent of a finance degree in order to understand how the money is spent. While it is increasingly difficult to understand the complexities of how schools within the state of Ohio are funded, it is also increasingly critical that taxpayers understand these issues in order to be informed voters.
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Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 17 2013 at 11:38pm
I agree, I used to drive 56 miles one way.......... But to fund local services , any city payroll tax min or high wage is better then nothing....Just min wage jobs are easier to create. Remember that "nickle" , it feeds the beast, LOL
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Posted By: Mike_Presta
Date Posted: Nov 18 2013 at 2:39am
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There is something to consider that is akin to an "unfunded mandate", and that is the $40 million dollars the state is dangling for the completion of our building program. Along with this $40 million comes strict requirements for the new middle school and the remodeled high school that jacks the total cost up to an astronomical (at least in the view of some) $95 million dollars! $55 million of this must come from the local taxpayers in the form of a new tax levy.
Given that the school district already owns all of the property involved, does anyone think that $95 million dollars is out of line to build a new middle school and to remodel the existing high school??? ------------- “Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012 |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Nov 18 2013 at 7:35am
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"The funding has already been ruled unconstitutional and they snub their noses at us" THEN WHY ARE THE SCHOOLS STILL ALLOWED TO PLACE LEVIES ON THE BALLOT? SOMETHING DOESN'T COMPUTE HERE. ------------- I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over. |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 18 2013 at 7:45am
It stands until another solution is found...............Keep giving them money and there is no reason for them to change. Requires a complete overhaul of the taxing system, something no politician will even attempt ...Would be political suicide.
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Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 18 2013 at 7:54am
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http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2012/03/25/15-years--no-school-funding-fix.html" rel="nofollow - http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2012/03/25/15-years--no-school-funding-fix.html
Kasich says to expect his school-funding plan next year. While it’s designed to move more dollars into the classroom, he predicts it won’t make everyone happy.
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Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Nov 18 2013 at 7:56am
SO THE CRITERIA FOR CONTINUING TO IGNORE THE DECREE OF UNCONSTITUTIONALITY AND THE BREAKING OF THE LAW IS BECAUSE THERE IS NO OTHER SOLUTION FOR NOW? BIZARRE REASONING AND LOGIC. ONCE IT WAS DETERMINED THAT THE FUNDING WAS UNCONSTITUTIONAL, IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN ABOLISHED. ISN'T THIS CRIMINAL BEHAVIOR, AND AS SUCH, THOSE RESPONSIBLE SHOULD BE CHARGED? EXACTLY HOW'S THAT WORK IN THIS CASE? ONCE IT WAS DECIDED, IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN ENFORCED. NOT A GOOD ENOUGH REASON FOR THE POLITICAL SUICIDE RISK. ------------- I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over. |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 18 2013 at 7:59am
Your government at work.................
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Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Nov 18 2013 at 10:23am
PUBLIC HANGINGS ARE IN ORDER AT THE FED, STATE AND LOCAL LEVELS. I'LL BUY THE ROPE AT THE LOCAL TRACTOR SUPPLY IF SOMEONE HAS A FEW TREES ON THEIR PROPERTY WITH SOME STURDY BRANCHES. NEED A DATE, SEND OUT THE INVITATIONS, CALL THE VENDORS AND ORDER THE SOUNDTRACK OF HANG 'EM HIGH TO PLAY DURING THE CEREMONY ALSO.  ------------- I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over. |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 18 2013 at 10:49am
You would have to go to a National forest to find enough trees.......... Let just hope some scared socialist wannabe doesn't misinterpret your post and you end up spread eagle, cavity searched and home ransacked. I will not have anyone to chat with...
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Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Nov 18 2013 at 11:27am
I wouldn't worry about that happening Hd. I've got guns. Not afraid to use 'em. Got a chip on my shoulder based on what life has dealt me the last 4 + years and really would enjoy someone attempting to knock the chip off. So let 'em try the "spread eagle", "cavity search", "home ransacked" thing. I wish them luck...... ------------- I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over. |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Nov 18 2013 at 11:41am
They are scared of guns , so they sneak in while you are snoring and let your guns watch them rape you.....
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Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Nov 18 2013 at 12:02pm
It'll be alright. I've learned to sleep with one eye open waiting for any distress from my wife at night. Light sleeper and wake up with any sound. I'll hear 'em. Been years since I actually had a full night's sleep.  ------------- I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over. |
Posted By: HdMechanical
Date Posted: Apr 30 2017 at 7:31pm
I am back  Life can get rough..... 
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Posted By: John Beagle
Date Posted: May 02 2017 at 1:55pm
Welcome back! ------------- http://www.johnbeagle.com/" rel="nofollow - John Beagle Middletown USA News of, for and by the people of Middletown, Ohio. |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Oct 26 2017 at 9:15pm
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Back the topic of sewers....... FOUR GUYS AND A HOLE.... Went to the Chase Bank at Briele and Roosevelt the other day. Next door to the exit, seems there was a big event happening regarding the city sewer department. Yeah. Seems there was three trucks parked up on the curb on Roosevelt all labeled as "Sewer Department". Two were larger service trucks with the yellow bubble lights a workin'. One looked to be a regular supervisor's pick-up truck with the yellow bubble light apparently warning all motorists that there was work being done and to watch out for the other two bubble light trucks up ahead. Upon further observation, there were four city employees standing around what looked to be a sewer cover removed and a hole with some sort of interest to these four city folks. They were just staring with great focus and probably were figuring out what to do with the hole. No backhoe in sight as is customary practice. None of the city people had a shovel in their hands so not your typical hole diggin' situation. Saw one employee attempt to jump in the hole as he saw something of interest. Don't know the outcome as I didn't have enough time to watch the whole event but I can imagine it got pretty darn interesting as time went by given the beehive of activity at that point. ------------- I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over. |
Posted By: whistlersmom
Date Posted: Mar 07 2018 at 10:00pm
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Read the Wed. 3/7/18 afternoon update of Journal News: Middletown City Council on Tuesday approved the first project as part of the $269 million Long Term Control Plan established by the consent decree with the U. S. Environmental Protection Agency to correct the issue, according to a staff report prepared by Scott Tadych, city public works and utilities director. Council approved a $338,400 professional services contract with Williams Creek Consulting to prepare the construction plans and specifications for the Bulls Run to Sunset Park Green Infrastructure Project. Comment: This so called Long Term Control Plan is a fool hardy delaying tactic which will continue (after 40 years) to avoid separating the sewers. Likely the EPA has no idea that Middletown (directed by Doug Adkins) has decided to waste more money by virtually applying a bandaid over a severed artery, just to delay complying with the order to separate the sewers. Why? Tadych said the project is the first identified in the LTCP that will consist of constructing a storm sewer to intercept a portion of the flow from the Bulls Run stream where it enters the combined sewer system near the intersection of Sheldon Road and Santa Fe Drive.
He said the intercepted flow from the drainage area will be redirected to an approximately one-acre regional green infrastructure retention basin located at Sunset Park, reducing storm water loading to the combined sewer system.
Comment: The intercepting storm sewer will combine with the sewer system containing raw sewage to be deposited in the retention basin. Instead of a swimming pool we shall have a cesspool in Sunset Park!
The project is required to be completed by mid-2019 under the terms of the federal consent decree. In his report, Tadych said that aesthetic landscaping and hardscaping features will be incorporated into the green infrastructure basin to not detract from the overall park character The existing play equipment may be relocated or replaced to accommodate the basin, the report said. In addition, the storm sewer installation on Sheldon Road will likely necessitate overall road improvements between Kenwood Drive and Santa Fe Drive, including waterline replacement, curb repairs and full width street paving. Councilwoman Ami Vittori noted there were a number of new families in that area that asked if there were any plans to install new play equipment at Sunset Park or to have a community discussion with the neighborhood. City Manager Doug Adkins said he would look into it. Has anyone considered the odor that may emanate from the retention basin, because the overflow will contain raw sewage from the combined sewers? No amount of “green space” landscaping is going to cover the stench and growth of bacteria in this proposed cesspool which may create a greater health hazard than our drug epidemic. I personally would not want my children exposed to that environment. ------------- "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing" Edmond Burke |
Posted By: buddhalite
Date Posted: Mar 08 2018 at 1:56pm
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Quoted from whistlersmom: "Comment: The intercepting storm sewer will combine with the sewer system containing raw sewage to be deposited in the retention basin. Instead of a swimming pool we shall have a cesspool in Sunset Park" I gotta say - I was at the meeting and in Adkins' own words, that was not the impression that I got. The impression I got was that the storm sewer flow was being intercepted and redirected to the pond in the park to prevent it ever getting to the combined sewer. I.e. send it to a retention pond rather than the sewer. ------------- "Every government intervention [in the marketplace] creates unintended consequences, which lead to calls for further government interventions." -Ludwig van Mises |
Posted By: whistlersmom
Date Posted: Mar 08 2018 at 3:59pm
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Glad you noticed this! And I believe you are correct. Sewage might not be included in the storm sewer water flowing into the retention basin. But, did Adkins guarantee that the size/depth of the basin was adequate to retain especially heavy runoff without overflowing? What would happen in that event? The combined sewers (including sewage) in that neighborhood have been notorious for backing up into basements when heavy rains occurred. Did he disclose what would eventually happen to any retained basin contents? Will it be released into the combined sewer? How would this be accomplished? This storm sewer is only a short segment, not directly connected by any other path to the river. Therefore, the only drainage path is the combined sewer, so the goal of separating the storm water from sewage is totally lost! It’s only a bandaid fix at an extra cost. If the water is retained in the basin for any length of time during the spring and summer, the stagnant water will become a breeding ground for mosquitoes, may grow a scum of algae, and may attract other undesirables right smack in the middle of a densely populated neighborhood, in what used to be their neighborhood park. Can we trust the city to maintain this monstrosity? This basin has the potential to become a health hazard and a hazardous place for curious children who might try to penetrate its barrier. Will this basin eventually be eliminated when (if) the “real” sewer separation occurs? If so, what a waste of our money!! Undoing it would, again, cost more money! Of what use would it be if left in place?? ------------- "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing" Edmond Burke |
Posted By: buddhalite
Date Posted: Mar 08 2018 at 6:32pm
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After my last post, I sent a note to Mr. Adkins to confirm the facts about exactly what water will flow into this basin. They almost always get back within a half-a-day so I'll confirm what I know tomorrow when they reply. Now - on to the rest of your comments: I can't imagine anyone purposely building a retention pond that wouldn't hold enough - and with the EPA looking over their shoulders (I do believe they approved this move) I'm not so worried about its capacity. As far as the current flooding goes - yes it is a problem, and diverting some of that water out of the combined sewer will definitely improve the situation for those residents. Is it enough to alleviate concern? I don't know that we have enough information on that. Retained basin contents? All of these ponds tend to follow the water cycle to a large degree and have spillways and overflow forethought. Most expect that the drainage has a 2 week life, so the ponds are sized to ensure they don't run dry - but also don't overflow (even on 10 or 100 year massive storm specifications). As far as stagnant water goes - if the basin is maintained properly - the design allows for proper movement and drainage and such - and with a less than 2 week HRT, well, stagnation isn't a problem. From what I can tell, and based upon my research, there would never be a reason to eliminate the basin. It's a basin, and it is biologically acceptable, actually ecologically preferred and never loses its purpose. There's a ton of information on these things and how to design them and maintain them on the EPA's website if you want to go and read it all. It kinda makes sense - so long as it is implemented properly and then maintained. That's the $64,000 question right there. ------------- "Every government intervention [in the marketplace] creates unintended consequences, which lead to calls for further government interventions." -Ludwig van Mises |
Posted By: whistlersmom
Date Posted: Mar 08 2018 at 9:14pm
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Thanks for the information. The EPA doesn’t really care precisely how their orders are carried out, but they will periodically test for positive results. They will continue to find non-compliance here because this single basin will only partially alleviate a very small percentage of a city wide problem. And all of the runoff collected will still eventually be dumped into the combined sewers, and sewer overflows containing sewage will continue to regularly be dumped into the river. We won’t have to imagine that this is inadequate. Actually separating the sewers is the only viable solution … so why not do that? If all the information for constructing this basin is so readily available on the EPA website, doesn’t $338,000 sound exorbitant for only the plans and specifications (no actual construction)? Got any figures on construction cost? Just because it may be offered by EPA as a solution, it doesn’t mean that it is the correct solution for this situation. Have they determined exactly how much sediment will go into the pond from the Bull’s Run stream bed? How will that effect the maintenance? Will the basin eventually fill with sediment? Remember what happened with lake mistake sediment? What other possible problems have not been addressed. Will we have neighborhood basins pock marking our landscape all over town? Is it ecological? Aesthetically pleasing? Or is it just an expensive side step to avoid making the inevitable correction … separate the sewers. As to whether the proposed basin would be properly maintained … that’s the $265 million question. Just look at city halls current reputation … all the incomplete, defunct revitalization projects and associated costs. Running a muck is our city hall specialty. ------------- "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing" Edmond Burke |
Posted By: buddhalite
Date Posted: Mar 09 2018 at 9:49am
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Well, I don't share the same immediacy of assumption that you do with all things. However - if you look at any new construction anywhere in our area - storm water collection basins are everywhere. It is a great way to deal with typical run-offs and can not only be aesthetically pleasing but ecologically sound. I'm not sure what your beef is here. I agree that one basin will in NO WAY solve the entire problem, however sometimes (and perhaps this is case here) baby steps are better than none at all. The biggest issue I have with this right now is that we the public (the wanting to know public) are as uninformed as we can be. We don't really know why this was the right step, we don't know why we're not going full blast with a separation, we don't know anything. This is why Middletown was foolish to step into a new era with the strong City Manager. You people keep electing milquetoast council persons who couldn't win their way out of a verbal argument against a stutterer - and the city is run behind closed doors even when the doors are wide open! As I say over and again - elections are the ONLY thing that matters at this point! It's one thing to get on here and discuss these things - but the constant bashing is getting old. Either 3 or 4 of us are going to get up and run for the offices or not. ------------- "Every government intervention [in the marketplace] creates unintended consequences, which lead to calls for further government interventions." -Ludwig van Mises |
Posted By: whistlersmom
Date Posted: Mar 09 2018 at 12:09pm
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The basins that were established when our neighborhoods were taking shape and being built were a necessary almost natural occurrence and in no way resemble the proposed one acre monstrosity that displaces a city park. And you are right, Mr Adkins has coaxed city council into giving him total control over them, city hall, and therefore, control over what every citizen in Middletown is “allowed” to do according to his rules. He has council and the citizens so blinded that no one even asks any questions about what he is having them vote on or approve. That’s a dictatorship! And dictatorships are notoriously ripe for corruption. About 10 years ago there was a lively contest for the election of new council and mayor. The insiders and incumbent council candidates successfully watered down the opposition voting capacity by encouraging such numerous candidates from the opposition. Each of those candidates had a following, leaving none of them to garner enough votes to win a seat. So, all of the opposition were defeated. ------------- "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing" Edmond Burke |
Posted By: buddhalite
Date Posted: Mar 09 2018 at 5:38pm
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Agreed. However - Adkins doesn't have any snowballed - the city charter GIVES HIM THAT AUTHORITY! First - we need to put some of our own up there in council and then we need to re-write the charter to actually give council more than a yes/no on everything....you are aware there is a no-messing-around clause in the charter? We've come to the point that the only thing that matters are elections. Who's running? ------------- "Every government intervention [in the marketplace] creates unintended consequences, which lead to calls for further government interventions." -Ludwig van Mises |
Posted By: whistlersmom
Date Posted: Mar 09 2018 at 7:05pm
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Adkins , I believe was instrumental in getting a rewriting of the charter to give him all the control ------------- "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing" Edmond Burke |
Posted By: whistlersmom
Date Posted: Mar 11 2018 at 7:39pm
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Thanks to MattR for publishing the EPA website address, http://wwwapp.epa.ohio.gov/dsw/maps/cso/index.php" rel="nofollow - http://wwwapp.epa.ohio.gov/dsw/maps/cso/index.php which reveals the sites of combined sewer overflows. In particular, the overflow run off going to Bulls Run CSO, that Middletown is currently addressing with the installation of the proposed basin, is shown as being dumped into the Hydraulic Canal, which is itself a catch basin. There is no indication of the Hydraulic Canal being connected to the river, because the city had blocked off the flow to the river years ago. So, it seems that run off going to the EPA indicated, Bulls Run CSO, will have no real effect on combined sewage entering the river and if there is a connection to the river, only a miniscule amount of the city wide problem would be solved. It’s not just a bandaid ... it’s a tiny bandaid. ------------- "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing" Edmond Burke |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Dec 25 2018 at 8:16pm
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Journal story-December 25th, 2018..... MIDDLETOWN — Middletown residents may be seeing a 10 percent sewer rate increase in 2019. This is the latest rate hike by the city as part of covering the costs of the $269 million Long Term Control Plan consent decree which was approved by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency last year. City Council will make a final decision on the proposed rate increase at its Jan. 8 meeting. This rate increase will cost a typical residential user an additional $3.38 per month based on 600 cubic feet of usage, according to Scott Tadych, city public works and utilities director. In his report, Tadych said sewer rates are reviewed with council as needed taking into consideration the operational, maintenance, and capital improvement needs of the sewer system. He said the sewer rates were last discussed in 2017 with a rate increase of 15 percent in 2018. The minimum monthly rate including the first 300 cubic feet is now $17.26. Starting March 1, 2019 that will go up to $18.99 a month. Over the past several years, the city has incrementally raised rates the past several years to build up the sewer fund for projects to implement the Long Term Control Plan. If council does not or delays a sewer rate increase, it could cause higher annual increases in the future. The city agreed to a consent decree with the USEPA to address combined sewer overflows. Therefore, sewer rates are being adjusted as needed to implement a Long Term Control Plan. The plan will include combined sewer overflow control projects along with major rehabilitation of the sewer system and wastewater treatment plant. The total cost is expected to be $265 million over the next 25 years. Middletown’s sewer rates are currently 53rd out of 63 communities surveyed for sewer rates based on the 2018 Oakwood Water and Sewer Rate Survey for southwest Ohio. Water rates in Middletown are currently 22nd out of 66 communities surveyed for lowest water rates. Water rates will remain the same for 2019. Combining both rates Middletown is 36th out of 63 communities surveyed So, in 2018 we had a 15% sewer tax added to your monthly water bill. Now, in 2019, we will have another 10% added for a grand total of 25% in the last two years. Knowing we have a low income community, will this frequency and percentage of taxation be affordable to those in this income level or for most people in the middle income level? Doubtful. Is leveling yet more taxes on the citizens the only answer for this administration? Is that all they know as to revenue generation? The combined sewer issue has been in play for a long time and the city delayed addressing this issue for years. Money was set aside years ago BEFORE the city started this extra taxation we see here. What happened to that money to cause these current tax increase frequencies? Where did that money go? The game of taxing the hell out of people never ends folks. They start a fund to take care of problems that arise, then suddenly ask for more when they divert and spend that fund money on their own little pet projects. Has happened before many times. Same game. Different day. Why city leaders, are you continually in the people's wallet? The sewer rates now are totally out of control at nearly twice the water rates. Hell, you can't afford to water your dam lawn anymore forcing you to let it burn up in the summer. Noticed people in the Oaks are watering less the last few years using their in ground sprinkler systems and they would be the ones who could most afford the high water bills. ------------- I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over. |
Posted By: buddhalite
Date Posted: Dec 25 2018 at 8:56pm
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Good grief! I already can't afford to pay my water bill (and trust me the sewer rates have been seen and felt already)! Plus, when I look at how the survey is calculated - it's a self-reporting survey...no actual bills, readings or anything of the like are examined or analyzed. Agreed - the leaders of our city only know one way to make money - tax us more. How about bringing jobs to the city and really getting the economy roaring again here before leveling any more taxes on us. You say it's not a tax BOB, IDIOT! (Just saving Middiemom some effort there) Look, the way I see it - it's a tax. Every resident has to pay it - and if you don't - you don't get services and the government is in complete control of it (see Vet's post above) so it's a TAX. I think if you ran as a candidate this year for council and just passed out literature and made signs that say "NO" - you'd probably win in a landslide. Furthermore the data analyst in me says that report shows something VERY interesting about urban vs rural systems and when you remove those outliers the picture is a bit clearer. ------------- "Every government intervention [in the marketplace] creates unintended consequences, which lead to calls for further government interventions." -Ludwig van Mises |
Posted By: middiemom
Date Posted: Dec 26 2018 at 11:36am
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Try it, Bob. Make some signs and run. Please run for council. Please. ------------- Middletown... Bright past BRIGHTER FUTURE!!! |
Posted By: spiderjohn
Date Posted: Dec 27 2018 at 1:14pm
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Go for it bob! Hoping that a few other new constructive faces try also. I would keep one maybe two of the currents, though with everything discussed behind closed doors prior to the meetings, it is hard to tell how individuals think(though 5-0 says plenty). I am all for positive new change down there new slogan? Middletown---it just doesn't get any better! |
Posted By: MattR
Date Posted: Dec 27 2018 at 2:11pm
| And the rest of his slogan could be 'but with your help, it could'. |
Posted By: MattR
Date Posted: Dec 28 2018 at 7:08pm
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At the most recent council meeting the city manager stated that according to the 2017 regional rate survey Middletown had rates in the bottom 25% of the jurisdictions reporting, 53rd of 63, and that this included the proposed 10% increase. The 2017 survey actually ranks Middletown as the 18th most expensive of 63 jurisdictions, placing in the top 1/3rd for cost. The 2018 survey, which has been available since April, rank Middletown as the 11th most expensive for sewer rates of 63 jurisdictions. This puts Middletown in the top 20% for highest rates and does not include the proposed increase. Germantown, Lebanon, Hamilton, Carlisle, Monroe, Franklin, Butler county, Warren county, Fairfield and Oxford all have lower rates according to the 2018 survey. |
Posted By: MattR
Date Posted: Jan 12 2019 at 1:13pm
| The increase approved makes Middletown the 8th most expensive of 63 jurisdictions. |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Apr 07 2019 at 12:39pm
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Today's Journal story concerning the new water and sewer, EPA mandated system to be built........ MIDDLETOWN — Middletown will soon begin the first of many steps as part of a federally mandated 25-year, $269 million Long Term Control Plan to reduce combined sewer overflows into the Great Miami River. This summer, the city will begin its $2.7 million project to construct the Bull’s Run to Sunset Park Green Infrastructure Basin that will intercept a portion of the stormwater flow where it enters the combined sewer sewer system near the intersection of Sheldon Road and Santa Fe Drive, according to Scott Tadych, city public works and utilities director.He said the project will be utilizing a natural and sustainable design method to mitigate stormwater by redirecting the flow from the drainage area to a one-acre basin that will be located at Sunset Park. ....... Middletown City Council on Tuesday approved the $2.71 million contract with Majors Enterprises, Inc. that was the lowest and best bid submitted from four contractors vying for the contract. ....... And now, info. as to how this will affect you as a water/sewer customer.... From the story..... 2018 area combined water and sewer rates in Butler/Warren countiesEach year, the city of Oakwood surveys 63 local government jurisdictions for their water and sewer rates. The amounts listed are based on 22,500 gallons or 3,000 cubic feet of water in a three-month period. Rates quoted are those in effect as of March, 1, 2018. The survey for 2019 has not been published. Butler County: $202.37 Warren County: $207.68 Fairfield: $212.46 Waynesville: $217.00 Franklin: $223.28 Oxford: $234.30 Monroe: $246.75 Carlisle: $250.20 Hamilton: $265.29 Lebanon: $278.64 Middletown: $282.57 Trenton: $288.36 Mason: $290.35 Springboro: $303.92 SOURCE: City of Oakwood Looks like Middletown customers will now start paying the fourth highest rates in the area. We are close to paying as much for sewer and water as the more affluent communities of Mason and Springboro, even though we have a fraction of the wealth living within the respective towns. We are now well over the average for Butler County as well. Looks like the former and current city leader procrastination in dealing with this problem has now caused the lower income citizens of this city a nice hefty increase. If history has repeated itself, we may be experiencing yet another case of the city using money earmarked for the sewer separation, EPA mandated project that has been diverted to other city projects over time. Shouldn't surprise anyone who is familiar with city budget manipulations that this has happened. Now, we all must pay the price in increased water bills for their poor budgeting practices where all project specific designated money goes to the General Fund to "get lost in the shuffle", re-distributed, and ends up on a "city friend's" project list. Thanks city leaders. Always fair and equitable toward the people who contribute to the game being played here. By the way, just got the latest water bill the other day. $20 bucks higher than the average before this bill for relatively the same usage. Just terrific! ------------- I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over. |
Posted By: MattR
Date Posted: Apr 08 2019 at 9:00am
| The city just approved taking money from the wellfied protection fund to pay for a new well. A new well should be paid for out of water rates, not out of a special assessment on top of the water rates. Not the first time this fund has been misused. |